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SynthHermit

Pearlie acting strange, also question about salt for fin rot

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    Test Results for the Following:
  • * Ammonia Level
  • * Nitrite Level
  • * Nitrate level
  • * Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) 6.4
  • * Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) 6.4
    Other Required Info:
  • * Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? API master
  • * Water temperature? 80*
  • * Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running?30G,about a week and a half with fish
  • * What is the name and "size of the filter"(s)? concorde 180
  • * How often do you change the water and how much? weekly,8.5G

  • * How many days ago was the last water change and how much did you change?last monday,8.5G
  • * How many fish in the tank and their size? 3 fish, 4", 2.5-3", 2" (roughly)
  • * What kind of water additives or conditioners? Prime
  • * What do you feed your fish and how often? omega one sinking,one or twice per day
  • * Any new fish added to the tank? no,just the loss of one
  • * Any medications added to the tank? tetracycline,2 doses so far,two more to go
  • * List entire medication/treatment history for fish and tank. Please include salt, Prazi, PP, etc and the approximate time and duration of treatment. was using maracyn and "quick cure" for 4 days, but they only got worse, so we switched to the TC on sunday. i should note that i had misunderstood the directions on the quick cure, and thought it said one drop per gallon per fish,when it really said one drop per gallon for each fish except those in the tetra group. so they got overdosed on that. hopefully that's not going to be a problem. carbon was put back in the filter and it cleared it out.
  • * Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? fin rot pretty bad on one, a little bit on the other two. base of pectoral fins on pearlie seem very red,as does part of his body near his gills
  • * Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? they hadn't eaten anything for 4 days, shown no interest.snarfed everything i dropped into the tank earlier,though. pearlie is a bit tilty(nose down),but will try to feed peas tomorrow to help that. breathing heavier than normal,could be remnants of the gill disease that haven't gone away yet. pearlie's fins are all erect, and pec. fins are pointing forwards instead of back towards his tail. never seen him do this before. also, back two pairs of fins (not tail fin) twitch occassionally. littlest oranda is bottom sitting alot, but she has the worst of the fin rot. poor thing's tail is nearly gone. pearlie seemed to be using left gills more than right when i looked at him when i got home, if that makes sense.

will get water params after i finish a huge english paper that's due in less than an hour. they're due for a w/c tomorow anyways.

AND I KNOW MY PH IS LOW. i can NOT get ahold of a buffer, and would rather not make them suffer through fluxuating ph anyways. they've lived in low pH water since I got them, and have been fine until this random outbreak of disease. sorry if i seem harsh,but i'm aware of this problem.last time i asked for help, all i got was complaints about the pH, and it's driving me up a flippin' wall.

only thing new added to the tank was a bubble bar that i hooked up last night. i moved the plug to the air pump (2prong) from the wall socket to the power strip (3prong) about 30min ago to see if that was the problem. i didn't feel anything different with the water when i put my fingers in. (other than the mini heart attack the pearlie gave me by nibbling on my fingers. he hasn't done that since i moved them into the 30G,and wasn't expecting it.)

sorry for the horrible grammar/spelling,kinda in a rush.

videos are uploading, will post when done.

EDIT

OH salt question. what is the dosage to help treat fin rot? i can't remember, and want to use aquarium salt after the TC, should it not finish the job

Edited by SynthHermit

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Just took readings.

Ammonia = 0

Nitrite = .25 ish

Nitrate = 0-5

Ammonia being 0 could be due to cycling or the fact that they haven't been eating,therefore no pooing.

Just witnessed the longest poo I've yet to see from the pearlie. About the length of his body.And it was a floater. So at least the air is getting out of his system. Will still feed peas in the morning.

I gotta say, I'm surprised nobody's answered yet...

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Just a few questions, because I'm not familiar with your first post. Is this a quarentine tank or your regular tank? I'm wondering because it hasn't been running long (a week and a half) and if you are only doing such small weekly water changes I suspect that water quality is the issue. What are you medicating for? What is your water change routine while doing the meds?

I get that you don't want to hear about your PH, but it is a real concern.

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As Amy says, PH is a real concern here. A low PH can drop suddenly, and with only one weekly water change of 8.5 gallons (which should be at least 15G if not more...in your case I'd say 80% weekly) your PH is probably not holding. A drop of even to 6 can cause great harm. A buffer will not cause your PH to fluctuate. You will add it each water change (and maybe in between... to keep it stable. You PH is likely fluctuating now with no buffer to increase hardness.

Here is an article to help you understand PH better, and WHY it is an important factor in your tank. :)

http://www.kokosgold...h-problems-r205

Crushed coral (or even shells) is a good addition to your tank to help with hardness too.

http://www.kokosgold...quantities-r195

Seachem Alkaline Buffer or Seachem Gold Buffer can both be bought inexpensively online!

Edited by Red

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This is my regular tank. I was finally able to move them from the 10G a couple weeks ago (had to convince dad to let me set up the bigger tanks),hence why it's so new. I would have a QT set up, but I have no room,no extra filters, or an extra tank/tub.

They were originally being medicated for gill disease, then ich popped up, and most recently the fin rot came into play.

And I know I should have, but I haven't had a chance to change the water since they've been on the meds. I'm going to do a large one later tonight,hopefully close to 16G ( four buckets filled with roughly 4-4.5G ea) I have to say, doing water changes is a pain because of lugging these buckets across the house (which really isn't all that bad,just kinda annoying),but mostly because my mom's always bitching about how it puts them under stress and how I just did one etc. She gets annoying when it comes to fish. =/

I've moved the heater farther away from the filter outflow, as I noticed after taking the first vid last night that it was getting wet.

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Water changes are not stressful for the fish. Everyone here does at least 50% once or twice per week. Many do 80% every week. Clean, fresh (temp & PH matched) water is normally our first action when fish seem off. :)

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I would stop ALL medications. More water changes, proper PH and .1% salt (1 teaspoon/gallon) for fins, would be where to start.

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Thanks Red for the salt concentration! I couldn't remember if it was 1% or .1%, and then .3% popped into my head from somewhere.

I'm halfway done with the TC treatment,and it seems to be helping. I have enough for one more full dose and 1/3 of a dose. Should I just finish up since there's not much left?

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And something I just now thought of: How long should I keep the tank at .1% salt for?

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Finish it up. But don't try any more meds. You've introduced 3 meds in a week...that is hard on a fish.

.1% salt and lots of big water changes is usually sufficient for healing fins. :) You are showing nitrites too which can cause some of the behaviour you see. Water changes lower that too. Also, lower the heat. 80 is too high. 72-75 is better for goldfish. I would keep the salt at .1% for a couple weeks at least. Remember to keep track & add back in what you remove each water change.

And order some Seachem Gold buffer, and crushed coral (coarse pieces not fine sand) a cup in a filter bag in the filter works wonders for PH. I use it. It lasts a long time. While your PH has always been low I know you feel like it has never caused issues...but now it is. Fish can handle things for a while and then suddenly it all falls apart.

If you can't get the PH fixed or do larger water changes....then nothing else can really be done to help your fish.

Edited by Red

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Thanks a bunch. I have the heat up that high because I heard the it helps with the healing. I can definitely turn it down when I get home if it's too high,though.

Would shells work as a buffer,or would that make it more acidic? I'm thinking the kind you see for hermit crabs.(Not the painted ones.)

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Shells will work...but they dissolve slower than crushed coral. If you use shells, boil them first and break them up, put in a bag in your filter. Probably cheaper to buy a bag of crushed coral though, a bag will last a long time. And with your low PH, you will need to replace the coral as it dissolves, so having a bag would be good.

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Mini Update.

Changed somewhere in the ballpark of 20-23G last night(with complaints from my mom,of course.I think she's starting to just give up complaining about all the water changes I do.).

Also added the 3rd full dose of TC and turned down the heater.Not exactly sure what temp the tank is sitting at now,since I'm stuck at school right now.

My plan of action is to give them today to just chill, and add the salt tomorrow after class.

All three seem to be doing pretty good. I don't see the rot on Alice anymore,although he's been zipping about a bit more than he was last week.Must be starting to feel better. Same with Tweedle Dee,I see very little of it on him,but his pectorals are still pointing more frontwards,and dorsal is still straight up. Not sure if this is something to worry about,but I'm keeping an eye on it anyways.

Even little Patches,who got the worst of the fin rot (tails nearly gone,had badbad body slime/fungus or something going on Sunday(appears to be gone now)), was venturing up off the bottom where she's been hanging out quite a bit last night. I was sure I was going to lose her by now.

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Excess slime can be a good indication that you have indeed got a case of finrot in the tank. I would suggest a large water change and a course of pimafix/melafix. If you have caught this early enough they will end it. They aren't stressful to the fish and won't harm your bb's either. Plus they aren't harsh like some medications out there.

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Excess slime can be a good indication that you have indeed got a case of finrot in the tank. I would suggest a large water change and a course of pimafix/melafix. If you have caught this early enough they will end it. They aren't stressful to the fish and won't harm your bb's either. Plus they aren't harsh like some medications out there.

I do indeed have fin rots. Patches is missing ###### near her whole tail. They've been treated with 3 out of 4 doses of TC (don't have enough for a fourth),the 3rd being yesterday,and as of tomorrow will be in .1% salt,with another w/c friday.

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