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Guest Heartless

we had a thirty gallon tank with four fish in it- three large goldfish and a black moor

they lived in the tank for about a month with no water changes. i was going to do a water change when i noticed my black moor, Blacky, was missing a large chunk of his fins and tail. i first thought the other fish had attacked him (this had happened to a fantail fish of mine in the past) and immediately removed him from the tank. i set up an old five gallon tank we had in storage, and let it run for the night, then moved Blacky to it the next day. i do not have a larger tank to move him too, we only have two old tanks and they are bother 5 gallons

for the tank i use wardley complete conditioner. it has a small filter that suction cups to the wall, i am not sure exactly what kind it is as i got it a few years ago but it is meant for 5-10 gallon tanks. it also has a small heater that is set to a preset temperature. the bottom is covered in about 1-2 inches of gravel, and he has some plastic plants and a plastic castle thing to chill in

when i set up the tank i did three quarters new water, and filled the last quarter with water from his old tank. i started adding melafix to his water to help his fins. i kept an eye on him as i was worried the stress would cause him to get ich, and about two days later found some spots on his tail. i did a 25% water change that night as i had messed up his filter when initially set it up and the water was a little cloudy

today i got him some aquarium salt, a bubbler, ich attack and maracyn-oxy (the only kind of maracyn my pet store carries). i tried to get advice from the people at the petstore but none of them knew anything about fish care. i did about a 20% water change, added in the aquarium salt, and put in the bubbler to give him more oxygen

the white spots on his tail are gone, and instead the end of his tail is a bit frayed

currently he is missing a large chunk of his side fins, with the ends being frayed and white. he is also missing a large chunk of the bottom of his tail, again with the edges being frayed and white. his top fin is fine. is behavior seems normal, he is not sticking to the bottom or the top of the tank, he seems pretty lively, though he does have a some issues keeping balance when he swims up (i believe this is caused by his torn up tail- the top is still mostly there but a lot of the bottom is gone)

i do not have a digital camera so i can not take any picture of him, sorry

at first i though my fish had attacked him and the stress was giving him ich, but now i am thinking he may have very bad fin rot. does this sound about right?

i tested his tank using a mardel brand 5 in 1 test strip (this test was before i did his most recent water change)

for the 30 gallon tank he was in

pH: 6.5

Hardness: 150

Alkalinity: 80-120 (darker than the 80, lighter than the 120)

Nitrate: 40

Nitrite: 0

(on a side note, all the fish in this tank are currently doing fine, none of them seem to be sick or infected with anything like Blacky has)

for the 5 gallon he is living in now

pH: 6.5

Hardness: 75

Alkalinity: 120

Nitrate: 0-20 (darker than 0, lighter than 20)

Nitrite: 0

he is missing a lot of his fins and appears to be loosing more tail

can he still be saved or at this point is it too late?

Edited by Heartless

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If the fish is still eating and acting normally, it is definitely not too late! But a few important things you absolutely need to do to help him:

-Do not use the test strips, they are grossly inaccurate. I recommend you buy the API freshwater master kit, it is easily found at most Pet*smart stores. It is just under $30, but well worth the price for the benefit it provides. I use my test kit every day, it is truly invaluable! We need test results from that test kit for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and pH. We need all of these numbers, just some won't do us any good at all. Without these numbers, there is not a lot we can do to help you no matter how much we want to help! Also please get a temperature reading.

-Secondly, I know you said you do not have a larger container, but it is very important. Five gallons is just not enough to dilute the massive amounts of waste goldfish produce. I realize tanks are expensive, so a cheap option is to buy a 10-15 gallon Rubbermaid tub. I recommend you let it soak full of water for 24 hours before putting the fish in, and then fill it with new water for the fish. This is because occasionally toxins can be leached from the plastic tubs, so by letting it soak you will avoid this.

-You do not need gravel in the quarantine tank. Gravel actually holds bad bacteria and makes the problem worse. You should remove the gravel a little bit at a time though over a period of a few days to avoid any problems. It is good that you added a bubbler. All goldfish need lots of oxygen, but sick fish especially do.

-Filtration. Could you tell us what type of filters you have? You need filters that will filter 10 times the water volume in gallons. Example: for a 30 gallon tank you need a combined filtering power of 300 gallons per hour. Your filters should also be full of ceramic media (and similar things) that make a good surface for beneficial bacteria to live on. This applies for your quarantine tank as well!

-Your main tank appears to be overstocked by quite a bit. You have three common or comet goldfish and one black moor right? This could have been a contributing factor to the problem with the black moor. The black moor requires at least 10 gallons, while the common/comets require at least 20 gallons per fish. Which means you should have a tank that holds at least 70 gallons. In order to keep these fish in good conditions and keep them healthy, this is the tank size you need to buy as soon as possible - those commons and comets easily reach a foot in length! Or you could look into re-homing a couple of them to someone who has a nice big pond. They also make large livestock water troughs that would be a fine habitat for your fish, and those are normally cheaper than a big tank.

Do you have a pleco in your main tank? I just ask because they are known to attack other fish and can sometimes be the cause of ripped fins or missing scales. Try not to panic. We can help you! :) I would strongly suggest you do not add any medications yet until you get the above points sorted out. If you do, you will most likely only do more harm than good. I think the salt will be okay for now, how much exactly did you add?

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hi there.

you don't have ammonia reading.

I cannot believe you have ok water in an overstocked tank with only monthly cleanings.... most of us on this forum change 50+% of the water each WEEK! and we stock maximum one fish per 10gallons.

you need to try and keep also your nitrates lower than 20.

I would take everything out of the hospital tank - goldfish don't need gravel and they also mostly get their fins stuck on the deco.

keep doing very large water changes as the water has to be perfect for him to heal. I think in this case 0.1% salt is enough in your water. make sure you measure it accurately.

are you sure the other fish are okey? I would plan a main tank general cleaning and look to upgrade your tank soon.

how do his fins and tail look? is it possible to get a pic? if it keep getting smaller it could be fin rot.

do not add any more meds to the tank except salt for now. some meds do more harm than good in less than perfect water.

good luck

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You definitely should see if you can get the drop test kit. We definitely need to see the ammonia levels.

Like Captain Findus said, it's amazing that your goldies are still even alive since they were in an overstocked tank, and hadn't had a water change in a month.

I second everything that Captain Findus and Sakura said, see if you can get a rubbermaid tub. I got an 18 gallon one for about 8 dollars at Target. They work great!

Also, when you clean the tank, be very careful especially if he have gravel, since it hasn't been cleaned in awhile, toxic gases could have built up and when you clean it, they may be released and harm your fish.

One last thing, what type of goldfish are the other three big ones?

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Guest Heartless

i really can't afford a $30 test kit at the moment

unfortunately i am the stereotypical starving college student with next to no extra spending money, and i just dropped around $30 getting stuff for his tank. (my family thinks i am ridiculous for trying to save this fish, but i won't give up on him, he's such a sweet little fish :C ) i am trying to find a cheap 10 gallon tank for him though so he can have a bit more space

also i think our nnnn can do water free water checks, i'll try to run some of his tank water up to see if they can give me better info on it (i probably won't be able to get out there until monday as it's a bit of a drive, but our local petstore is where i tried to get help before and no one there knew anything about fish)

i know our other fish aren't in ideal conditions but when i was younger, we have what would be considered too many fish in our tank and very rarely did water changes, and those fish lived for years without getting sick. (they never did die on us, we moved and had to give them away.) so i think it possible for the other fish to be ok...? i know they aren't living in perfect condition but my mom randomly just got them for our family because she found a cheap tank on craigslist, the fish themselves were cheap generic goldfish from nnnnnn. i'm not even sure exactly what kind they are, they are just super generic looking goldfish. (the black moor was added in by me because i was disappointed with my family's boring fish choice. i didn't mean to give him bad living conditions, and will probably just keep him in a tank in my room.) there are no plecos in the tank. i did do a water change on the big tank the other night, and am going to try to be better about keeping up with it.

i have checked these fish several times, and they all appear a-ok. none of them are acting sickly or show any physical signs of being ill. (even though they aren't in amazing conditions right now, i think they are doing better with us then they were at nnnnnn... i stopped by there the other day too get a bubble stone and took a peek at their black moors, and two dead ones were floating around in the tank. not the most comforting thing to see.)

i will start to remove the gravel from his tank along with his plastic plants.... when i do water changes i use a siphon on the gravel, so hopefully it isn't that dirty?

i do also have a tree-trunk-stone-hedge-thingie in there, is it ok if i leave that in the tank? he likes to sleep in it and i'd feel kind of bad taking it away from him.

i did a google search and this is the filter is tank currently has. is it an ok type of filter...? since it is only meant for five gallon tanks, i am going to buy him a new one when i get him a bigger tank and i was planning on just using the same type

i really wish i could provide a picture of him, but i do not have a digital camera. my sister has one though, when she gets home sunday night i'll see if she'll let me borrow it for a few so i can take some pictures of him.

for the salt, i dissolved it in water first then added it in with his water change last night. the box said to do 1 tablespoon for every five gallons, but since he had never had any salt in his tank i did a bit less that that.

i will do another water change tonite and add another teaspoon. i was kind of worried since i read some fish don't respond well to salt, but he seems to be doing fine (aside from his terrible looking fins and tail).

if he does have fin rot, will the salt help him...?

since he's lost so much fin, i am just worried he will loose more and not be able to swim anymore

about how fast does fin rot progress?

thank you all for the responses, i hope i answered all your questions! i'm glad Blacky still has a chance

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i really can't afford a $30 test kit at the moment

unfortunately i am the stereotypical starving college student with next to no extra spending money, and i just dropped around $30 getting stuff for his tank. (my family thinks i am ridiculous for trying to save this fish, but i won't give up on him, he's such a sweet little fish :C ) i am trying to find a cheap 10 gallon tank for him though so he can have a bit more space

also i think our nnnn can do water free water checks, i'll try to run some of his tank water up to see if they can give me better info on it (i probably won't be able to get out there until monday as it's a bit of a drive, but our local petstore is where i tried to get help before and no one there knew anything about fish)

Instead of looking for an entirely new tank, you can get a rubbermaid. It's a lot cheaper if you don't have the money and you can get a whole bunch of them. Definitely do a large water change if you don't know the parameters.

i know our other fish aren't in ideal conditions but when i was younger, we have what would be considered too many fish in our tank and very rarely did water changes, and those fish lived for years without getting sick. (they never did die on us, we moved and had to give them away.) so i think it possible for the other fish to be ok...? i know they aren't living in perfect condition but my mom randomly just got them for our family because she found a cheap tank on craigslist, the fish themselves were cheap generic goldfish from nnnnnn. i'm not even sure exactly what kind they are, they are just super generic looking goldfish. (the black moor was added in by me because i was disappointed with my family's boring fish choice. i didn't mean to give him bad living conditions, and will probably just keep him in a tank in my room.) there are no plecos in the tank. i did do a water change on the big tank the other night, and am going to try to be better about keeping up with it.

i have checked these fish several times, and they all appear a-ok. none of them are acting sickly or show any physical signs of being ill. (even though they aren't in amazing conditions right now, i think they are doing better with us then they were at nnnnnn... i stopped by there the other day too get a bubble stone and took a peek at their black moors, and two dead ones were floating around in the tank. not the most comforting thing to see.)

The generic goldfish are most likely common or comets, and you should really think about re-homing them, and keep your little black moor in a 10 gallon if you can afford it, and upgrade later. They get quite big. It's POSSIBLE for them to be ok, but it's really not nice. You should probably be doing at least 75-80% water changes daily on the main tank, just because the ammonia levels will be off the charts. But definitely see if you can rehome the commons/comets, because when they get sick they'll end up costing a lot of money :(

i will start to remove the gravel from his tank along with his plastic plants.... when i do water changes i use a siphon on the gravel, so hopefully it isn't that dirty?

i do also have a tree-trunk-stone-hedge-thingie in there, is it ok if i leave that in the tank? he likes to sleep in it and i'd feel kind of bad taking it away from him.

The siphon should definitely help. Is the tree-trunk-stone-henge hollow? It can keep toxic gases in it, especially with gravel. In my little quarantine tank I left in some plastic plants just so he'd have something to look at, but definitely no gravel. You'll discover how much easier goldfish tanks are to clean with no gravel. It's like heaven.

i did a google search and this /Aquarium-Stingray-Submersible-Filter-Gallon/dp/is the filter is tank currently has. is it an ok type of filter...? since it is only meant for five gallon tanks, i am going to buy him a new one when i get him a bigger tank and i was planning on just using the same type

i really wish i could provide a picture of him, but i do not have a digital camera. my sister has one though, when she gets home sunday night i'll see if she'll let me borrow it for a few so i can take some pictures of him.

for the salt, i dissolved it in water first then added it in with his water change last night. the box said to do 1 tablespoon for every five gallons, but since he had never had any salt in his tank i did a bit less that that.

i will do another water change tonite and add another teaspoon. i was kind of worried since i read some fish don't respond well to salt, but he seems to be doing fine (aside from his terrible looking fins and tail).

if he does have fin rot, will the salt help him...?

since he's lost so much fin, i am just worried he will loose more and not be able to swim anymore

about how fast does fin rot progress?

thank you all for the responses, i hope i answered all your questions! i'm glad Blacky still has a chance

I think that filter should be ok for the time being, the only problem is that goldfish need x10 filtration just because they're so dirty. If you get a new filter, I would recommend a HOB filter (Hang over the back) that filters x10 the water.

Pictures would definitely help.

It sounds like it's definitely fin rot. It will most likely heal completely with salt and heat and pristine water. I cannot stress enough the wonders of clean water. You need to change his water daily so that the salt will help him out. Make sure you monitor how much salt you put in, because it doesn't evaporate. When you change his water daily add back that amount.

You're doing very well, and I'm sure Blacky will thank you for the good care :)

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Guest Heartless

i'd really rather just get him a new tank... rubbermaids may be cheaper but i i'd rather have a nice fishtank sitting on my entertainment center instead of a large plastic tub...

i'll see what can be done about the big tank... it is technically my mom's, and she thinks all this stuff is pretty dumb. our fishkeeping ways have always just been dump the fish in the water and feed it once a day, and they always lived long lives... this is the first sick fish we've ever had. (our last batch of fish were swordfish and mollies though, maybe they don't need as much space...? )

i always siphon the rocks when i do water changes, so that's good to know. after i remove the rocks, should i keep them out permanently, or can i put them back in when he gets better? i don't mind siphoning/washing the rocks occasionally, i think they make the tank look kind of nice

also, when the rocks are gone, will i have to do anything to the bottom of the tank to keep it clean?

his little hidie hole plastic thing is hollow, is there something i can do to it to make it safe for him, or should i try to invest in another piece for him?

when i get his new filter, i'll get one of the hanging kind.

i got his tank a thermometer but forgot to put it in (i just put it in now), about what temp should i aim for? i've read you should keep goldfish at temps ranging from 65-85 degrees, which is a pretty big range.

also i have question about his bubbler- i just use a bubble stone, and the instructions say to make sure it stays at the bottom of the tank. right now i use his gravel to keep it down, is there another easy way to keep it weight to the bottom of the tank?

and umm is it normal for him to like to swim into the bubbles? sorry if that is a silly question, but today i caught him just swimming into the stream of bubbles, they'd push him back and then he'd just swim right back into it... it was cute, but i just want to make sure that's not abnormal or anything.

thanks again for all the advice, it's really helpful!

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If the commons are your mom's fish then there's not much you can do. But I do think that you should at least attempt to guide her in the right direction as much as you can, because honestly the conditions they're living in are very bad. Common goldfish should reach a foot at least in length, produce a lot of waste, and live for 20+ years. Really they would be much better suited in a pond and then your mom could get some of the small tropical fish she had before. The types of fish you mentioned stay much smaller, produce much less waste, and don't live nearly as long as goldfish. That's why their care is much less involved.

As for your fish, since you don't know the water quality you should be doing at least 50% changes each day once you have your fish in a 10 gallon tank to himself. You can keep the gravel out permanently- I do in my tank and I think it looks nice. It's good to scrub the bottom with an aquarium safe sponge (not a household cleaning sponge!) as gunk can build up on the glass. You can leave the back glass unscrubbed if you want a nice layer of algae to grow, it is beneficial to the fish. If you want to leave your gravel in over the long run, just make sure it is not a deep layer- only keep just barely enough to cover the bottom and siphon it weekly. But for now, during treating, I just think it will be easier for you to leave it out.

When you do bring your water to the store for testing, make sure they use the drop test kit and get results for all of the following: ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and pH. We need them to tell you exact numbers, not just "your water looks okay". Bring a pen and paper with you to write down the numbers they tell you. If they can tell you GH and KH that will be helpful as well. You really do need a test kit of your own though as soon as possible. If I were you I'd get a cheap rubbermaid just for temporarily, and save your money for a test kit. That is of the highest importance right now. You need to be able to test your water at home on your own, because the quality can change dramatically throughout the day.

For salt, there is a specific regimen that should be followed. I don't have much experience with fin rot though, so I think you should wait for someone to tell you the exact best thing you should do. A moderator or other very experienced member will be able to tell you that. For now, just keep doing what you are doing. Do not add any more salt, and do not add any other medications! Keep up with daily water changes and make sure you keep the water temperature stable when doing water changes.

If you end up keeping this fish in a 10 gallon long term, you need a filter that at least turns 100 gallons per hour. I always recommend the Aquaclear brand, because they are a hang-on-back type but also have a lot of room for filter media. You can use airline tubing suction cups to hold the air stone down. They sell these at pet stores for pretty cheap. The ideal temperature for fancy goldfish is about 74-75 degrees. You can use a heater to keep the temp stable. With such a small volume of water I actually think a heater is a good idea, because smaller volumes of water won't hold a stable temperature as well. And yes, it's normal for some fish to enjoy playing in the bubbles! :) Mine never have, but I've heard about that a lot.

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Guest Heartless

i'm a little confused on the salt

should i replace it every time i do a waster change...? it's suppose to be a tsp per gallon, so should i put another tsp in for every gallon i replace? (this is the impression i got from reading about the salt)

or should i only be putting in a certain amount for x amount of days?

i'll stop by the store and grab him suction cups tomorrow for his bubbler... he swam into it enough that he knocked it out from the rocks in was in, i think it will be a worthy investment

since the water is so important, i'll try to scrounge up enough money for a water testing kit as well. i'm also going to return the ich medication i bought him, so there's a bit more money to put towards the testing kit (i had to buy what must be the world's largest bottle of ich away, as that was the only size the store carried, the refund shall be beneficial)

i just did about a 20-25% water change (i was afraid changing to much may hurt him)

from now on i'll start doing 50% changes

he does have a small, preset heater in his tank so while i'm not sure exactly what temp his water is at right now, it should be pretty stable

i started removing some rocks- how much should i remove a day?

also, can takes go without tops for a while?

i found a cheap ten gallon aquarium

but it does not come with a top, it's just the aquarium itself

would this be ok? since they can live in rubbermaid tubs, i'm guessing they can survive a topless tank as well?

also, as for my mom's fish i'll see if she'll just let me give away the goldfish and get some mollies instead C:

my mom and sister really like mollies too, so they'll probably go for it

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Yeah the thing about salt is that it never evaporates out. So even if the water level drops due to evaporation, the same amount of salt you originally put in stays in. But when you do a water change, you remove the salt along with the water. So you will need to add back the amount of salt that you removed by the water change. So like you said, if you have one teaspoon per gallon and you remove one gallon, you need to add back one teaspoon of salt. I'd say that for now .1% is what you should keep it at (unless a moderator says otherwise later on). I'm not sure how long you should continue that concentration, but it will be fine to maintain until a mod stops by.

It is hard to say how much gravel is safe to remove each day, but just to be extra safe (since you don't have a test kit yet) I would just remove a little bit each day. Like 3-5 handfuls? This is just my best guess really! And yes, fish can go without a lid for a while. Some fish jump, but this is more often seen with the commons and comets. I have never had a telescope that jumped, but it is possible. You can put some type of netting or grate over the tank to prevent this while you are waiting to get a top for the tank. Or you could even use a clean rubbermaid lid. Anything that will prevent jumping out. Just make sure the fish has some light to see by since it won't have a tank light. You could place a lamp nearby (just not too close) or just use indirect lighting from windows. And remember, 10 gallons is the minimum. You can make it work, but if you find a 15-20 gallon tank at a similar price you should go for that one if you can.

Great plan, that would really be a win-win for everyone if they agreed to the mollies! :) You are doing great, and it is so nice to see how much you care for your fish.

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hi heartless, :welcome

i'm sorry your cute little blackmoor isn't the best at the moment.. you are getting some really good advise to help nurse your baby back to good health...

you're doing well.. keep up the good work and you shall begin to see some positive results soon..

we look forward to seeing the pics once you have use of your sister's camera..

helen

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Guest Heartless

still no pics, sorry, hopefully i'll have them tomorrow :C (it was a busy day today, i honestly just forgot to bother my sister as i wans't around her much when she got home)

i did do his water change, removed a bit more gravel and kept up with the salt, thanks for clearing that up

i do have a new problem now- his poop is now white

from the stuff i read about goldfish, this is normally a bad sign...?

it hasn't been like this the whole time, it was the color of his food like two days ago

i was doing his water change today and noticed it's white now

i recently change his food (i went from tetrafin goldfish flakes to aqueon goldfish granules, as i heard that kind of food is easier for moors to eat), could this have upset his stomach? or is it most likely something different?

for light, he is actually right across from my window so he gets plenty of natural light, and at night i have my bedroom light on until i go to bed, so i think he will make it without a top for a while. nnnnnn had 10 gallon tanks for $10, i'll see if they have any bigger ones at cheap prices

also i got the temp of his water, it's around 82 degrees

is that too warm for him?

the heater i use for him is a preset heater, so you can't adjust the temp

but i think we may have another heater at my gramma's house so i can try to dig that out if he needs a lower temperature

he's still acting normal

and there is less white around the edges of of his tail and fins now... i'm not sure if what he has is getting better, or if he just lost more fin/tail, but i don't think his fins look any shorter so i'm hoping its the first one C:

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Yep, 82 is way too high. Do you know what the normal room temp of your room is? You really should either remove the heater (if your room temp is fairly stable) or get a heater that you can adjust. Just make sure that when you lower the temperature, you don't lower it too quickly. Example: if you drop from 82 to the recommended 75 within just a of couple hours, that could shock his system too much.

The white poo can be a sign of stress. The stress could be coming from poor water quality (although I realize you are trying!), high temperature, or any number of things really. Do you notice any other symptoms on the fish besides the missing fins? Any odd lumps or bumps where there shouldn't be? Are the scales raised at all? If they are you will see it best from above. If everything else on the fish looks normal, I think we should assume the white poo is not a huge worry right now. Just to clarify the white poo is long, stringy, and clear/white right? Keep an eye on the poo situation and let us know if you continue to see white poos like that.

Changing to granules is a step in the right direction! Are they sinking granules? It's best for goldfish to eat sinking foods because the floating ones cause them to gulp too much air. Gulping air can cause buoyancy issues. A really good quality sinking pellet is Hikari Lionhead or Saki-Hikari. I have seen it in a few smaller fish stores occasionally, but normally you have to order it online. It is better quality than that Aqueon stuff though. If you want the absolute best quality, you can consider making your own fish food in gel form. I use a recipe that is super easy to follow, here's a link to it: Gel Food Recipe P.S. I use salmon instead of sardines because sardines are too stinky! Gel food is also great, because it's really not too expensive, especially if you're just making it for one fish! If you do decide to make it, make sure you store the extras in freezer bags, not just regular ziplocs, and double bag them for freshness. :) I made the mistake of using regular ziplocs the first time I made gel food, and the food got freezer burned and rancid.

If you don't want to make the gel food just yet, you should at least try to feed him some veggies on the side along with the granules. I think peas one or two times a week would be a good place to start. I feed my fish peas once a week because it is a minor laxative to prevent constipation, plus goldfish need a lot of greens in their diet. If you want to feed peas, you can soften them in the microwave or by blanching them, and then remove the outer skin.

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Guest Heartless

so blacky is looking much better C:

his fins no longer have white edges to them and just look better on the ends. his poo kind of switches back and forth between white and the color of his food... i'm hoping once i get him in a new tank and don't have to change his water so often, he'll become less stressed?

i almost have all the gravel out of his tank, and this weekend he is getting a new tank, filter and heater

i'll also probably get him some food from online, i don't trust myself making his food. if i give him peas, about how many should i give him?

still haven't gotten water readings unfortunately, i ended up picking up an extra shift monday so that kind of took up my free time. i'm going to try to get out there tomorrow hopefully

this leads me to two new questions though: once he has a bigger tank (i am going to try and get him a 15 gallon), how often should i be doing water changes? and how long do i keep adding salt to his water for?

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I am so glad to hear he is doing better! You're doing a great job. :)

I still think the white poo is probably stress related, but it's hard to tell for sure without the water test readings. Is he acting normally- active with a good appetite still? If so that is a great sign. As far as peas go, about how big is he? I usually feed my fish about 3 chunks per day that are the size of their eyeball. Not the size of the entire bulging out part of the eye, but the size of the eyeball itself. You can choose to feed it all at once, but it's better if you can split up the feedings through the day.

For an established tank that is the proper size and has proper filtration, you should do one water change of at least 50% each week. But initially you might have to change the water more often to keep the ammonia and nitrite levels down. Once the tank is established (cycled) then you can switch to once a week. Only the test kit can determine how many water changes you need to do. Otherwise you are just guessing really. I do suspect that it will be easier to maintain good water quality in the larger tank though. About the salt, I don't know for sure... but what I would do is keep the salt in there for a little while longer (a few days or so) and make sure that you continue to see improvement. Probably the clean water is doing more for his fins than the salt is, but the salt is helping to ease some stress and that is good too. How much salt do you have in there right now?

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i'm so happy to hear that blacky is better.. keep up the good work :)

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Hi and :welcome

First, you have been given some good advice.

Second, if you don't have test kits and it hasn't been at least 2 months personally i would do daily water changes to keep ammonia down.

You really don't need gravel since goldfish are very messy and poop a lot....it is easier to take care of them with a barebottom tank. Daily vacuum cleans in a non cycled tank can be exhausting!

White poop is caused by many things....stress, infection, eggs......so without water parameters.......Serious 50% water changes daily for at least two months or until u can get drop tests. For now if you could at least get PH, Ammonia, and Nitrites that would be great.

Keep us informed and good luck with your fishies! :heart

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Guest Heartless

so Blacky has a new problem- he has ich :C he's still acting normal right now, but the spots are pretty clearly ich

his tank is currently at about 84 degrees, i am doing water changes and keeping up with the aquarium salt. from what i read warm water + salt is the best way to get rid of ich, so i'm trying to follow that

is there anything else i can do for him? i do have some ich attack, or will that mess up his water more? i got him a new tank, but i didn't get the test kit, that is going to have to wait until my next paycheck

also should i wait to move him to a new tank now? the ich showed up around friday night, it was just a few spots

i've been keeping an eye on him to see how it goes, and tonite it's gotten a little worse. i mean it's not horrible, but he has maybe 3-4 new spots on him. right now he has about six little spots on one side, and about four on the the other. they are all pretty close to each other.

i know stress is what causes ich, and i think this is kind of my fault. i made a booboo with his water change last week and put in water that was too cold, the temp dropped really fast on him :C i've been more careful with the water temps since then. there is a slight temp change whenever i do his water changes- usually about 2 degrees, is that normal?

also, as far as moving him goes- how exactly should i go about it?

like should i move water from his old tank into the new one or what....? i know just dumping him in completely new water isn't good. i don't want to stress him out more with a move, but at the same time i think a bigger tank would give him nicer living conditions. not sure exactly what to do

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Hi there, you have been given GREAT advice by Sakura. She is tops! :) As witness by the fact that blacky has been getting better and better.

Now, Ich, you say? Where exactly are the spots? On the gill plates? On his tail fin? On his front fins?

You read correctly, Ich is best tackled with warmth and salt.

How much salt do you have in there at this moment? 1tsp per gallon? You can up that to 2tsp total today (so add another 1tsp per gallon) and then tomorrow you can add ANOTHER 1tsp for a total of 3tsp per gallon.

The ich should start to fall off. And you need to keep the salt at 3tsp per gallon (otherwise known as 0.3%) for at least a WEEK AFTER you see the last ich spot fall off.

DO NOT add ich medication. It's bad news. Won't help, and will actually do more harm than good. What size tank is he in now?

To move him to his bigger tank, you need only put his filter on the new tank with new DECHLORINATED, TEMPERATURE AND PH MATCHED water and transfer ONLY him (no old water is necessary). And don't worry, a 2 degree temperature change one way or the other should not cause any harm. :)

At this point, it is more important to get him into a bigger tank than worry about weather the move will stress him. Honestly.

Make sure you put the right amount of salt into his new tank so it's the same percentage as his old tank.

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