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ABB63

New 48 x 24 x 16 tank - fish transfer

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It’s in and what a gorgeous setup. Thank you all so much for your advise. Things went perfectly smooth moving from the 40B to the new 80 gallon reef tank. They are so happy. They just keep swimming back and forth.  the large and small pieces of mopani have  been soaking for a couple of weeks now and the water water changes are almost running clear. Our LFS has a new shipment of plants coming in midweek so I’ll get some plants on the wood and put them in this week. I attached the before and after photos.

Again, thanks everyone for your help getting me here. 

 

4EB3E217-4F4C-4F64-AA83-971524B3C30C.jpeg

46ABEE7F-40D9-4413-A12C-DC476071B05D.jpeg

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On 8/6/2018 at 11:31 PM, aussieJJDude said:

Water changes also help to replace lost minerals as well, which the fish use.

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Will you please identify one of those minerals?  I read about these mysterious minerals that must be in all tap water but in no other source -- such as food -- but I've never seen anyone name them.

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On 8/6/2018 at 10:29 PM, ABB63 said:

One more question. I’m going from a 40 gallon tank to an 80 gallon tank with two 8” long body fish.  I do a water changes every week now on the 40 gallon. How often do I need to do a water change on the new 80 gallon tank?and how much should I change out? 

You can't go wrong following the water change recommendations in the guidelines.   You have a big tank,  but you also have big fish.   How old are they, and does the 8 inches include the tail fin?

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These two are 3 years old. Body is 8”  w no tail. I transferred all 40 gallons from their existing tank then added the second 40 gallons with new water. 

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They still have some growth to complete.  They probably won't get much longer, but they will get taller and wider.  I have a red comet with a standard (tail not included) length of over a foot.  I don't know how much over, since I would have to catch her to measure.  I would have to start by draining the pond , so I will just  continue to estimate her size.

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Good to know they won’t get a lot longer. Because now they can swim back-and-forth and it’s nice long space for them. She’s a lot wider than he is. I thought maybe because she’s the female. We’ll See. 

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They can get a 10" body without fins. I've had several get that size in my old pond/small lake lol.

But hose are some really nice fish!

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Will you please identify one of those minerals?  I read about these mysterious minerals that must be in all tap water but in no other source -- such as food -- but I've never seen anyone name them.

🤣 All you had to do was a little google, not hard at all!

 

While some minerals are present in food, especially high quality foods, I think if you can easily supplement from the water, why not? Excess minerals will pass right through, but say they aren't getting enough from their diet (like in humans, calcium and magnesium ratio, and the importance this is received in an appropiate balance). An imbalance can lead to issues not only in the tissue, but also in the bone as well nervous systems. So why not just ensure that some small minute concentration is in the water, incase diet alone isnt enough? :)

 

But to name a couple, since your not aware:

- calcium

- magnesium

- iron (I believe they also have hemoglobin, so iron... correct if wrong) :)

- potassium

- sodium

- Zinc

 

 

This site may be of assistance, while its targetted at humans the basics still apply - I've learnt very quickly at uni that basic animal functions are (basically) the same between most species. ;)

 

https://www.prestigewater.com.au/articles/what-minerals-are-found-in-tap-water.htm

 

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Thank you. I have really grown to love them. I love watching them now they are swimming around. 10” though .... geeez. I hope this Tank is going to be big enough.

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So I am noticing my PH low.  I washe the new tank with a rag soaked in vinegar and water then rinsed that a couple times. I thought I got it all rinsed away. I think that’s what it is. I have shells in the canister normally to keep the ph up. A couple of hours ago I put some baking soda water in to bring it up some. A little concerned. 

Will watch it at about a 6.6 / 6.8. 

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I forgot to mention that the new digs look great! My bad.

What's the pH of the tap?

6.6-6.8 isnt that bad IMO, the goldies will adjust fine to a pH of that level without issue.

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19 minutes ago, aussieJJDude said:

I forgot to mention that the new digs look great! My bad.

What's the pH of the tap?

6.6-6.8 isnt that bad IMO, the goldies will adjust fine to a pH of that level without issue.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 

 So I am noticing my PH low.  I washe the new tank with a rag soaked in vinegar and water then rinsed that a couple times. I thought I got it all rinsed away. I think that’s what it is. I have shells in the canister normally to keep the ph up. A couple of hours ago I put some baking soda water in to bring it up some. A little concerned. 

Will watch it at about a 6.6 / 6.8. 

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My tap is really good so I know it’s not that. I do notice when the shells wear down after a while the ph goes off a little bit. It’s up enough now that I put a little baking soda in. Usually it’s between 6.8 and 7.  I’ll make sure I add some shells to the filter.

What is going to happen when I put that mopani wood in there with plants attached? Is that going to change the pH as well? The mopani is really well soaked now but I still think it’s going to change the water somehow.

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1 hour ago, aussieJJDude said:

🤣 All you had to do was a little google, not hard at all!

 

While some minerals are present in food, especially high quality foods, I think if you can easily supplement from the water, why not? Excess minerals will pass right through, but say they aren't getting enough from their diet (like in humans, calcium and magnesium ratio, and the importance this is received in an appropiate balance). An imbalance can lead to issues not only in the tissue, but also in the bone as well nervous systems. So why not just ensure that some small minute concentration is in the water, incase diet alone isnt enough? :)

 

But to name a couple, since your not aware:

- calcium

- magnesium

- iron (I believe they also have hemoglobin, so iron... correct if wrong) :)

- potassium

- sodium

- Zinc

 

 

This site may be of assistance, while its targetted at humans the basics still apply - I've learnt very quickly at uni that basic animal functions are (basically) the same between most species. ;)

 

https://www.prestigewater.com.au/articles/what-minerals-are-found-in-tap-water.htm

 

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

 

 

 

The question was not what minerals can occur in water.   The answer to that is probably all of them, but different ones in different water sources.  Your water has different minerals from mine, and different levels of the minerals that may occur in both your water and mine.   

You know that, I'm sure, but you bought into and repeated the silly internet myth that you have to change water to replace essential minerals that the fish use up.  Actually, water changes can reduce the excess minerals released from the fish food (before or after digestion) and these can present a problem to fish.

Now tell me what essential mineral is not present -  in much higher concentration than would ever appear in tap water - in fish food.  

Just an interesting observation:  When I first set up an aquaponics system, I was told at the hydroponics/aquaponics supply store than the fish provided the plants with every mineral in the amounts required with the exception of iron.  Iron supplements are listed in the ingredients on my fish food, but they aren't supplied  in large enough quantity that the fish waste will meet the iron needs of the plants. 

After about a month, my plants showed signs of iron deficiency so I looked up the iron compound that would dissolve in my hard, high pH water and added in in the recommended concentration.  The plants recovered rapidly.   In a few days I found two of the fish swimming upside down.  They didn't have a swim bladder problem since when I tossed in some food they righted themselves and gobbled it up.  They were just expressing discomfort.  I removed them to clean water and they showed no problems, so the iron was what bothered them.  I cut the amount of iron in  half at the next treatment and had no further complaints from the fish or plants.

 

 

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My tap is really good so I know it’s not that. I do notice when the shells wear down after a while the ph goes off a little bit. It’s up enough now that I put a little baking soda in. Usually it’s between 6.8 and 7.  I’ll make sure I add some shells to the filter.

What is going to happen when I put that mopani wood in there with plants attached? Is that going to change the pH as well? The mopani is really well soaked now but I still think it’s going to change the water somehow.

The mopani wood may lower the pH even further, so the shells would help. Just keep an eye on it, it may have no effect, might be the opposite.

 

 

 

~~~~~~~~~~

 

The question was not what minerals can occur in water.   The answer to that is probably all of them, but different ones in different water sources.  Your water has different minerals from mine, and different levels of the minerals that may occur in both your water and mine.   

Without meaning to sound like an arse, you did question what minerals occured in water... or most likely, thats how i perceived it. But in essence, you water will still contain those minerals, regardless of concentration.

 

You know that, I'm sure, but you bought into and repeated the silly internet myth that you have to change water to replace essential minerals that the fish use up.  Actually, water changes can reduce the excess minerals released from the fish food (before or after digestion) and these can present a problem to fish.

I dont really think I was brought into the internet myth. It was studying biology back in highschool (think I was like 14) that I had a similar conclusion. And reading the 'myth' did make sense IMO.

 

How do we know that the food contains enough for the fish? Not trying to cause a fight or drama, but one thing I've learnt from studying animal nutrition is that the packaging isnt often what you think... or at least in Australia, the food industry is very... vague (?) and can be difficult to determine whats actually good or not.

 

But I do agree with you, the removal of minerals in the watercolumn could cause problems rather than solutions, especially if not supplemented fully through food!

 

Now tell me what essential mineral is not present -  in much higher concentration than would ever appear in tap water - in fish food. 

Did I say this? If not, my mistake. I was meaning to say it offers a good supplement!

 

Just an interesting observation:  When I first set up an aquaponics system, I was told at the hydroponics/aquaponics supply store than the fish provided the plants with every mineral in the amounts required with the exception of iron.  Iron supplements are listed in the ingredients on my fish food, but they aren't supplied  in large enough quantity that the fish waste will meet the iron needs of the plants. 

After about a month, my plants showed signs of iron deficiency so I looked up the iron compound that would dissolve in my hard, high pH water and added in in the recommended concentration.  The plants recovered rapidly.   In a few days I found two of the fish swimming upside down.  They didn't have a swim bladder problem since when I tossed in some food they righted themselves and gobbled it up.  They were just expressing discomfort.  I removed them to clean water and they showed no problems, so the iron was what bothered them.  I cut the amount of iron in  half at the next treatment and had no further complaints from the fish or plants.

Thats certainly what you experienced, but having supplemented my aquatic plants with iron and have no issue that you mentioned... I wonder if it was the compound that the iron was in that made them sick... Some compounds could have negative effects. But its certainly an interesting case regardless.

 

 

Do we agree on waterchanges also removing hormones? If not, agree to disagree - on the whole matter? We have had our successes regardless, so does really matter?

 

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5 hours ago, aussieJJDude said:

Do we agree on waterchanges also removing hormones? emoji6.png If not, agree to disagree - on the whole matter? We have had our successes regardless, so does really matter?

Find a biology textbook and look up the definition of hormone or even use the definitions you can find on the web.  Then tell me why you would find hormones in the water.

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Find a biology textbook and look up the definition of hormone or even use the definitions you can find on the web.  Then tell me why you would find hormones in the water.
Touche. Thanks for that pickup, mean pheromones.. ;) what happens when you work a large shift and its late at night....

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On 8/18/2018 at 8:21 PM, ABB63 said:

 So I am noticing my PH low.  I washe the new tank with a rag soaked in vinegar and water then rinsed that a couple times. I thought I got it all rinsed away. I think that’s what it is. I have shells in the canister normally to keep the ph up. A couple of hours ago I put some baking soda water in to bring it up some. A little concerned. 

Will watch it at about a 6.6 / 6.8. 

Put some calcium reactor medium in the top of the canister in a medium bag and it seems to be bringing the ph back up. Feeling a lot better about the transition. I especially want the ph stable before I add the mopani and plants.  I want to put the plants In with the wood Thursday but I’m concerned I’m not going to have enough time to watch things before I travel on Monday next week.

is 3 days enough time to see how new plants and wood effect the water?

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7 minutes ago, ABB63 said:

Put some calcium reactor medium in the top of the canister in a medium bag and it seems to be bringing the ph back up. Feeling a lot better about the transition. I especially want the ph stable before I add the mopani and plants.  I want to put the plants In with the wood Thursday but I’m concerned I’m not going to have enough time to watch things before I travel on Monday next week.

is 3 days enough time to see how new plants and wood effect the water?

If your ph is that low, I wouldn't add the wood in. Wood will lower the ph and most ppl add it to tanks that need a lower ph.

If it was me, I would try some Wondershells and see if that would help you. I use them in my 40B tank and it keeps the tank stable and adds the minerals into the water that the fish need. :) 

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9 minutes ago, koko said:

If your ph is that low, I wouldn't add the wood in. Wood will lower the ph and most ppl add it to tanks that need a lower ph.

If it was me, I would try some Wondershells and see if that would help you. I use them in my 40B tank and it keeps the tank stable and adds the minerals into the water that the fish need. :) 

The ph has only been off since I transitioned from the 40 gallon to the new 80 gallon Reef tank Saturday morning. 

Thanks for the advise. I’ll look wondershells up. I’ve had a bag of seashells in the filter for a couple years now and the pH is been right up at seven for the most part. The shells were really getting small. So instead of getting more shells, and now that I am running  a canister (since June), I thought I’d go to crushed shells.  the LFS guided me to the calcium reactor media. 

Ive had a bare 40b tank for a few years and I really wanted to go to some wood and plants now that I have the room.  Should I not put wood in ever? 

 

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6 minutes ago, ABB63 said:

The ph has only been off since I transitioned from the 40 gallon to the new 80 gallon Reef tank Saturday morning. 

Thanks for the advise. I’ll look wondershells up. I’ve had a bag of seashells in the filter for a couple years now and the pH is been right up at seven for the most part. The shells were really getting small. So instead of getting more shells, and now that I am running  a canister (since June), I thought I’d go to crushed shells.  the LFS guided me to the calcium reactor media. 

Ive had a bare 40b tank for a few years and I really wanted to go to some wood and plants now that I have the room.  Should I not put wood in ever? 

 

I wouldn't put it in till you get the ph stable and your there to watch. I put some wood in my guppy tank years ago and it lowered it pretty good, but they can deal with it better than the goldfish can. :)

I get mine at  petmountain.com they have the bulk for a good price. I would also do you shells in the canister. I have never used the calcium reactor media so I can't help there :o 

 

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2 minutes ago, koko said:

I wouldn't put it in till you get the ph stable and your there to watch. I put some wood in my guppy tank years ago and it lowered it pretty good, but they can deal with it better than the goldfish can. :)

I get mine at  petmountain.com they have the bulk for a good price. I would also do you shells in the canister. I have never used the calcium reactor media so I can't help there :o 

 

Yeah I think I’ll wait until I get back from my trip. This reactor is crushed shells so it’s like shells but it has a lot more surface area than the shells I had in the filter. I have a really big piece of mopani and 6 small pieces. I think I’ll try a couple of really small pieces with some plants on them and see what happens with just that little bit of wood. Thanks for your advice I really appreciate it.

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Smaller pieces should be a big issue but the bigger ones seem to cause the problems. I would wait till you get home to see if it does go down. :)

No problem anytime :) 

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31 minutes ago, koko said:

I wouldn't put it in till you get the ph stable and your there to watch. I put some wood in my guppy tank years ago and it lowered it pretty good, but they can deal with it better than the goldfish can. :)

I get mine at  petmountain.com they have the bulk for a good price. I would also do you shells in the canister. I have never used the calcium reactor media so I can't help there :o 

 

Yeah I think I’ll wait until I get back from my trip. This reactor is crushed shells so it’s like shells but it has a lot more surface area than the shells I had in the filter. I have a really big piece of mopani and 6 small pieces. I think I’ll try a couple of really small pieces with some plants on them and see what happens with just that little bit of wood. Thanks for your advice I really appreciate it.

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I will be totally bummed out if I can’t use that beautifully big piece of mopani I am soaking. 

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