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waya

How many goldfish?

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How many goldfish would you put in a 30inch long X 13inch wide X 5inch tall tote? I can also add a sump to it if they needed more water volume. ATM there both small just little babies, just 6 grams.

Two of my goldfish are REALLY bad swimmers and I'm thinking it maybe better for them in something like that instead of a 40g. One Finless seems to have some swim bladder problems, also has a messed up spine. His back end seems to float up. Nothing seems to help with it. The second Flag seems to just have problems. At times it like his tail is to much for him so he doesn't normally swim much and when he does he seems to fall tail 1st back to the tank bottom.

Finless This is how he normally floats.

20170220_004144.jpg

Flag He's sitting on my finger in this picture, but he's normally tail down or laying on the ground. He some times seems to try compensating for his tail and taking a nose dive back to the tanks bottom.

20170220_003935.jpg

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Welcome to Kokos!  You will find info on stocking in our guidelines for healthy goldfish.

Shallow water with a large surface area makes the best container for fish that has swimming problems.

You can certainly keep two little fish in that tote long term.  I use 8 gallon totes like that as hospital tanks serving one or two adult fish, but do 100% daily water changes.  

How many little fish do you have?  How large a sump do you plan?

One of these, with a filter and regular water changes, can handle quite a few little fish.  See this set up.  

Edited by shakaho

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Finless is beautiful. Looks like a phoenix or eggfish, very uncommon.

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7 hours ago, shakaho said:

Welcome to Kokos!  You will find info on stocking in our guidelines for healthy goldfish.

Shallow water with a large surface area makes the best container for fish that has swimming problems.

You can certainly keep two little fish in that tote long term.  I use 8 gallon totes like that as hospital tanks serving one or two adult fish, but do 100% daily water changes.  

How many little fish do you have?  How large a sump do you plan?

One of these, with a filter and regular water changes, can handle quite a few little fish.  See this set up.  

In the guidelines it doesn't really go in to detail on how many gallons or square per fish just that they don't follow the same 20g rule.

Yea that's why I was thinking they'd like to be moved out of the 40 into a tote. They can swim longer without floating up or back down to much.

In my question I kind of didn't word it the way I mean. What I really wanted to know is if these 2 would fit in that tote and if they can fit in it even when they grow up or only temporarily? Trying to keep it to a water change every other day or so.

I have a lot more then just these 2 little guys but there the only 2 I'd be moving. For the sump what size would I need to make that tote work if I only wanted to do water changes every other day or so? I know for sure I want at least a 10g tank just so the pump and filter media could fit and to not drop water levels in the tote to much when doing a water change. I do also have a 20g long I could use as the sump. Not sure where I'd put the tote/tank yet so not sure how large a space I'd have to work with. I just want to try fingering out what parts I need and seeing where I could move them as I think they'd be happier that way.

I've seen that videos and others like it, like one with a kiddie pool but when you see/read 20g/10g per stuff then see the tote doesn't even hold 10g I get a little lost as to what is or isn't going to work. ATM all my goldfish are in 40g breeders, totes around 40g and even 50g totes but there all more normal tank dimensions. I have used the tote I'm asking about temporarily hooked up to my 40g before to separate a few fish but it was only for a month or 2.

I don't know when exactly when I got them but I've had them over 6 months. They eat ok in the 40 just don't seem to move much. They also both don't seem to be growing much. I'm guessing they were around  4-6 grams when I got them and only 9 grams now so there growing slower then most my other babies. My others have went from the same size babies to 10-16 grams. 

Here's a picture of Panda so you can see the size differences. Panda and his friends are all around this size now and there growing up in a colder room with less feedings.

20170220_010344.jpg

 

 

 

3 hours ago, Goldiegirl said:

Finless is beautiful. Looks like a phoenix or eggfish, very uncommon.

Thank you. I fond him/her just hanging out in a tank at Meijers with the fantails. Little odd ball I just had to take home. So maybe but guessing more likely just a defect.

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Maybe, but I think it suits him/her :)

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14 hours ago, waya said:

In the guidelines it doesn't really go in to detail on how many gallons or square per fish just that they don't follow the same 20g rule.

?? 

Quote

Your tank should be large enough to provide at least 20 gallons for each goldfish. This is true for both long-bodied and fancy goldfish. While baby goldfish can do well in a smaller tank short term, they grow very fast, so we recommend starting them in their grown-up tank. 

I thought that pretty clear about gallons.  Since aquariums come in such a wide variety of shapes,  you can't make a better gallons per goldfish rule.

I have never found a sensible rule about goldfish per surface area, so I'll make one up right now.  Virtually everyone agrees that a 40B makes a good tank for 2 goldfish.  A 40B has 4.5 ft of surface area, so we can say that  each fish should have at least 2.25 ft2  of surface area provided that the tank has a depth no more than 16".   Likewise, virtually everyone agrees  That a 20L makes an adequate tank for one goldfish, and certainly better than the typical 20 high.  The 20L has a surface area of 2.5 ft2, so that fits.  It also has a height of only 12 inches.

In my question I kind of didn't word it the way I mean. What I really wanted to know is if these 2 would fit in that tote and if they can fit in it even when they grow up or only temporarily? Trying to keep it to a water change every other day or so.

Yes they fit, but whether they will fit forever depends on how big they get.  A 50% water change every other day should work if you don't overfeed.

I have a lot more then just these 2 little guys but there the only 2 I'd be moving. For the sump what size would I need to make that tote work if I only wanted to do water changes every other day or so?

The tanks you mention would work fine for sumps.  You might also consider making a pond-type filter.  I'm still using the one in the link 5 years later.  

I regularly recommend, for fish with trouble swimming or maintaining balance, very clean, shallow water with lots of swimming space and duckweed only for food .  The shallow water makes balance easier; more swimming space encourages swimming, which makes them better swimmers; clean water removes pollutants (such as nitrate) that may affect balance; and the duckweed helps correct digestive problems such as gas accumulation or constipation that can simulate swim bladder disorder.  A few fish recover and can return to an aquarium.  Some improve in the treatment tub but their problems return with a return to the aquarium.  Some don't improve, and you probably can't do anything for them.

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I just wanted to let you know that they seem to be doing a little better in to tote. They still don't swim right and spin out a little but not doing random uncontrollable flips as much.

Finless doesn't seem to be floating as much and seem to be controlling his/her movement most of the time. Seen him/her do a few flips but not float or sink.

Flag seems to still have a little more of a problem. (S)he isn't sinking anymore but seems like swimming is still a problem when turning. Seems kind of like over estimating a turn. When ever (s)he tries to swim sideways/turn (s)he loses control and her/his tail seems to whip to far around making him/her wiggle a lot to try straighten back out. Make me kind of question if the tail is just to long for the body.

Still going to just leave them in there for now. They seem to have room to grow so as long as there looking better I'll just let them grow in there and not try putting them back in a 40g. If they (mainly talking about Flag) don't get better do you think i should just letting them go on as is in the tote or maybe putting him/her to sleep? Would it be wrong to try cutting her/his tail a little shorter if it doesn't get any better in the next few months?

They are eating just fine. Don't have any duckweed atm but like I did last summer I'm sure ill have a lot of it soon.

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Which tote did you get?

If it provides 2 square feet of surface area per fish, you can keep them in there permanently.  

I wouldn't trim the tail.  

Edited by shakaho

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30inch long X 13inch wide X 5inch tall tote that I already had.

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Sorry, I forgot about that.  They might get big enough eventually that they need more swimming space to encourage them to stay active, but with your proposed water changes and sump, they won't have any water quality issues.

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