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silver8328

New betta has bad eyes

15 posts in this topic

Hello everyone,

On Sunday I was at Petsmart and walked past the bettas and noticed one with a whitish eye. I knew he was more then likely blind and that is why I wanted him. I felt bad and wanted to give him more then being stuck in a tiny cup in the off chance that there may be someone else out there that would buy a not so perfect fish. Plus he's marked as a dumbo so his price was $13. I asked about him and got him half off because not only that eye but his other eye is also messed up.

Here is an over head shot from the day I got him. He was still in his store cup floating in the tank I am now keeping him in.
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b233/mypetz/IMG_1795_zps12e3b8eb.jpg~original

This is his right eye, the one I first noticed at the store. He is able to move the eye but it doesn't look like he can see out of it at all. Also I have no idea what the black dots are. Does that happen to a "dead" eye?
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b233/mypetz/IMG_1824_zps571ae1c6.jpg~original

This is his left eye. It is definitely swollen but it also has something growing at the bottom in the bubble. I'm not sure if it was caused by damage to the eye or if it's a tumor or what, any ideas? You can sort of notice in the pic but both eyes have an iridescence to them, more so on the other eye, the same metallic iridescence as his body. I'm not sure if that has anything to do with it either.
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b233/mypetz/IMG_1825_zpsc5f97b25.jpg~original

Right now I have him in a 2ish gallon kritter keeper with a heater keeping it at a steady 80. It's only the third day but I have been doing daily water changes and his appetite is fine. It may take him a minute to notice there is food but once he knows it's there he eats it with no problem. I don't think he is completely blind but I don't think his has full vision in his "good" eye either. The first couple days he swam mostly counter clockwise around the tank. Maybe to learn his space? While watching him today he seems to be swimming around more freely. After each water change I make sure everything goes back where it was so it doesn't confuse him. He only has the heater, thermometer, a betta leaf and a holey cave ornament to hide in, which he does but is mostly out swimming around. No plants or anything in it yet. I wasn't prepared and I only have plants that may hurt if he bumps into them. This isn't going to be his permanent home and eventually will be set up in a 5 gallon with a filter and live plants. But I wanted to see what, if anything, I can do for his eyes first. I was hoping clean water would be enough but I think he may need more then that. Would espom salt help? If so how much. He is in 1.75 of water. What about meds?

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Hope he feels better.

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Congrats on the new betta!

Please do start with epsom salt. You can start with a dose of 1/4 tsp per 10 gallons. Do you happen to have a slightly larger tank available? such as a 5 or 10 gallon - I am worried that dosing meds is going to be hard in the critter carrier since it is such a small volume and it sounds like we also don't know exactly how many gallons it is.

I'd also like you to pick up some maracyn II please :)



Could you also provide test results for tap and tank ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and pH?

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Thank you. Yes I do have a 5 gallon, the one I was going to put him in after I got a filter and some plants for it. Until then I thought it would be easier to do 100% daily water changes that's why I have him in the KK. I already did the water change for today not that long ago so it shouldn't be that different then the tap which is, ammonia I believe is zero but to be honest it may be .25, nitrite is zero, nitrate is 20 and Ph is 7.5.

I'll get the 5 gallon ready and move him over in a little bit and I guess add 1/8 tsp of epsom salt since it's only a 5 gallon. I can probably get out to a petstore in the next day or so to pick up some maracyn II, if he can wait that long. He doesn't seem to be bothered by his eyes at all and the one that's protruding doesn't look any worse, it doesn't look any better either but at least it doesn't look worse. He seems very active, is eating with enthusiasm and is pooing normal.

What do you think happened with his eyes? Do you think he was born with the blind eye or do you think it's possible what ever is going on with his other eye caused it? And I guess you think it's bacterial and that's why you're reccomending maracyn II? I've had a fish with popeye before but nothing like this so it's all new to me. Thanks for helping.

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It does look like popeye, and my guess is that the cloudiness may be bacterial related. I honestly have no idea what is going on with the other eye just yet though. Its a good sign that he is active and eating though! :)

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Here are both the eye shots zoomed in so you can see them better.

Here is the right side again,
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b233/mypetz/zoomed2_zps8e5e9905.png~original

Here is the left side. The top that looks cloudy is just iridescence other then that this eye is clear. The problem, I think anyway, is the growth on the bottom. I tried to get a better pic but they keep coming out blurry.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b233/mypetz/zoomed_zps9dd65aca.png~original

Oh and I moved him over to the 5 gallon with the epsom salt.

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He's beautiful! Best of luck. :bighug

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How are things going? were you able to get the maracyn? :)

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Yes, I was able to pick up some Maracyn II last night but I haven't started dosing it yet. I have read that some meds can be more harsh on a betta and full strength doses aren't recommended but I'm not sure about Maracyn. I know with antibiotics you want to make sure you complete the full course though.

I was also able to take a couple more pics. In this one you can see the eye completely from the side. To me it looks like the eye, for the most part, is fine. As far as the pupil is concerned anyway. There is something growing under (or on?) the eye within the clear membrane over the eye though. Which seems to be why the eye is swollen. I think with the lump on the bottom and the iridescence on the top it's blocking some of his vision but the eye is, at least at this point, working fine. He is already recognizing me as the one who feeds him and when his "good" eye is facing out and sees me near the tank he goes up to the corner where I have been feeding him. And last night I pressed my finger against the glass and he sort of jumped back a bit and started to flare but I stopped once he started because I didn't want to stress him out. I just wanted to make sure that he could see and wasn't just feeling the vibrations of me getting his food ready.
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b233/mypetz/eye2_zps68ec97fe.jpg~original

This picture is from straight on and you can see how the lump is stretching out the outer layer of the eye.
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b233/mypetz/front_zps47fca6db.png~original

Do you still this maracyn II is good for this? Since it doesn't appear to be normal popeye. Could the lump be bacterial? Or is it a tumor? Or maybe even just damaged somehow? I have had him for 5 days now and it doesn't appear to be getting bigger, or smaller. I just want to make sure the meds will help and not just case undue stress. Not that he is acting stressful and actually seems happy and healthy other then his eyes. No clammed fins, usually always out swimming around and even built a bubble nest the other day. I don't want you to think I'm second guessing you and I do thank you for helping me with this, it's just that I don't even like taking meds unless I have to. The whole thing with treating for things but not treating long enough or with the right type of meds and creating super bugs just freaks me out. I do of course want him to lose this lump if it's possible so he can see a little better and not be in pain. I'd imagine having something growing on your eyeball is painful. Thanks again.

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Let me talk with the rest of the moderating team. I am honestly not sure what that lump is. Bettas, particularly dragon scales, are certainly prone to tumors. I will have the rest of the team come by and take a look at the new pics :)

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So sorry for not getting back to you sooner, I have been really sick the last couple days :(

So, having talked it over with our other mods and a couple other forum members who have betta experience the general consensus is that the red fluid sac under the one eye is likely a cyst, possibly a tumor. If it is cyst, treatment with the epsom should help with reducing fluids in the eye. If it is a tumor, there's not much to be done.

Regarding the cloudiness in the other eye (which I had wanted the maracyn for), BronwynH PM'd me and suggested that this may actually be an instance of where the scales on a dragonscale betta actually begin to grow over the eyes. She noted that she'd only seen this in darker colored bettas, so the effect is more obvious, but this very well may be what we are seeing. In this case there is nothing to be done.

Have you seen any reduction in the size since starting the epsom?

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No worries and I hope you're feeling better. :)

I've been looking around and read about how scales can cover the eyes but it wasn't until I saw the post from Kiara that shows a pic of a scale covered eye. The cloudiness looks the same but with my fish his eye seems almost sunken in and has black dots. Maybe my guys eye has been covered long enough that the eye is dying? I don't even know if that's a possibility.

As far as his other eye goes I haven't noticed any difference to the size, shape, or color to the lump since I got him last Sunday, so I don't know if that is a good thing or a bad thing. I mean obviously it's a good thing that it hasn't gotten worse but it also hasn't gotten better. I have been keeping him in 1/8 tsp epsom salt since he is in a 5 gallon, should I up the amount and see if it helps, keep it as is or stop? It's day 6 now for the epsom salt. I've been looking around and on another site found some cases about lumps in and around the eye but they weren't quite the same and there was never any conclusion as to what it was or what happened with the eye so they really were of no help. I'm not familiar with cyst, or even tumors but if it is a cyst is it possible it can completely go away over time? Or is the best it can do is shrink in size? Also what causes them? Is it something that can be contagious? I have his tank next to my other bettas tank and since my older guy has been able to see him he has been blowing bubble nest much more then usual and seems to have stopped his tail biting. I was thinking of, instead of having two separate tanks I could just put them both in a divided 10 gallon. But of course won't if there is any chance whatever is causing the lump could be contagious. Again thanks for your help.

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Hi Silver, since you're at day 6 of epsom treatment, there's no need to change the dose.

The cyst or tumor is something that you can't do much for, in either case, other than trying to reduce it. Cysts will usually burst on their own. Since it's in they eye, it'd be worth dosing some antibiotics if it does burst just to reduce the risk of infection. Other than the lump, that eye looks relatively good. Cysts are only considered contagious when they burst.I think it's more likely a tumor than a cyst, but if it's not getting any bigger and epsom doesn't reduce it, I would just leave it alone unless there are changes

Hope everything goes well :)

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