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LisaCGold

Dry Fertilizers from Green Leaf Aquarium

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I'm thinking of using a dry fertilizer from GLA and I need some help.

I don't use CO2. Lights are Finnex FugeRay Planted+. They are on for about 6 hours a day. Plants are anubias, java moss, marimo moss, and sword. I use Flourish tabs for the sword. The tips of the anubias leaves are turning yellow/brown and then disintegrating (sorry I couldn't get pictures--for some reason I can't mail pictures from my ipad to my laptop right now). The java moss is not growing well these days. It use to, but not now.

Amm=0, NO2=0, NO3<5.

I currently use the GH Booster from GLA. I think the anubias and possibly the java moss would benefit from a fertilizer.

Thoughts? Would one of the dry ferts from GLA help? If so, which one? Thanks!

____________________

The following was added to this thread by DNAlex on 08.10.14 at the request of LisaCGold. The entire text is Lisa's :)

In this thread, I describe my adventure in getting the aquatic plants in my tank healthy through the estimative index method of fertilizing. This started because I changed lighting from some low-light fluorescent tubes to the Finnex Planted Plus lights which are medium range lights. A couple of weeks after this switch, the plants in the tank started to have problems.

To best understand what is happening in this thread, you'll want to read the following ahead of time:

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/113173-using-par-instead-of-wpg-to-measure-light-level-in-a-planted-tank/ Especially the part about "lighting and balanced the aquarium" towards the end of the article.

http://www.barrreport.com/showthread.php/2819-EI-light-for-those-less-techy-folks This is about the "estimative index" method of fertilizing plants in aquariums.

Additional one on EI:
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/fertilizing/15225-estimative-index-dosing-guide.html

Enjoy!

Edited by dnalex
added additional text to first post, as per request

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I'm wholly unfamiliar with their line of fertilizers, but if you contact the folks over there, I've heard that they are supremely helpful, and will set you up with the products that you require. :) Hopefully, Tithra will chime in with what she uses.

Let us know what you end up getting! :) I plan to do my next order from there, when I finish with my own dry ferts. :)

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I use their EI pack (estimative index), and dose according to that schedule. In a lower light tank with less needy plants you can follow the EI schedule, but just dose 2x a week instead of daily (macros on one day and micros the next day). I would suggest dosing the full range as opposed to trying to figure out what one nutrient might be deficient because then you have all your bases covered ;) and of course pick off those dead and dying leaves so that your plant puts it's energy into growing new ones.

You can also give gla a call and see what their thoughts might be. I know they have great customer service.

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I use their EI pack (estimative index), and dose according to that schedule. In a lower light tank with less needy plants you can follow the EI schedule, but just dose 2x a week instead of daily (macros on one day and micros the next day). I would suggest dosing the full range as opposed to trying to figure out what one nutrient might be deficient because then you have all your bases covered ;) and of course pick off those dead and dying leaves so that your plant puts it's energy into growing new ones.

You can also give gla a call and see what their thoughts might be. I know they have great customer service.

Thank you, Jess! The EI pack does look like the easiest. I've sent an email to GLA. I'll let you know what they say. I also would like to fertilize my shrimp tank so I asked them about that too.

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I've been emailing Marco back and forth. He determined I don't need any fertilizers. He thinks it may be a lighting issue. Not enough light. The Finnex FugeRay Planted+ is for low-medium light type of plants. I emailed Finnex for the PAR ratings. They said for these model of lights the PAR values are not currently available from the manufacturer. No wonder I couldn't find them on their website!

I do have lots of algae in the tank--green, brown, and brown hair algae. I reduced the light to just 6-7 hours a day and this reduced the algae a bit. Should I turn on the light more and dose the tank with excel to reduce algae? Maybe that will help the anubias somehow?

Jeez, now that I have the tank cycled and fish very healthy, the plants need some figuring out.

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I talked to my lfs that sells the Finnex LED lights. They say it might be the light is too bright. I can move the plants towards the back and move the light towards the front.

I can try that before thinking about using Excel.

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I had a feeling GLA might tell you that you don't need any ferts, they told Alex the same ;) I guess that since I have been using ferts for awhile now, I lean more towards trying them, even a low dosing schedule, if plants seem to not be doing well, simply because it doesn't hurt to try. It is possible to have nutrient deficiencies even in a low light tank depending on bioload and water changing schedules etc. :idont

I know that the planted + are supposed to be somewhere between the fuge ray and Ray II in terms of par, which should be low-medium light depending on your tank depth. None of the plants you have are particularly needy in terms of light. Swords do tend to do best with a nutrient rich substrate and root tabs though, which it sounds like you are already doing.

Can you remind me what size your tank is?

How are your anubias planted? Are they in the substrate or tied?

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I had a feeling GLA might tell you that you don't need any ferts, they told Alex the same ;) I guess that since I have been using ferts for awhile now, I lean more towards trying them, even a low dosing schedule, if plants seem to not be doing well, simply because it doesn't hurt to try. It is possible to have nutrient deficiencies even in a low light tank depending on bioload and water changing schedules etc. :idont

I know that the planted + are supposed to be somewhere between the fuge ray and Ray II in terms of par, which should be low-medium light depending on your tank depth. None of the plants you have are particularly needy in terms of light. Swords do tend to do best with a nutrient rich substrate and root tabs though, which it sounds like you are already doing.

Can you remind me what size your tank is?

How are your anubias planted? Are they in the substrate or tied?

I have the anubias super glued to rocks. Goldfish tank is 29 gallons with a 2.5 gallon refugium. The shrimp tank is 8.6 gallons. The anubias have been in the tanks about a couple of weeks now. In the goldfish tank is where the tips of the leaves started disintegrating first. I'm going to try to post pictures.

I do a 80% water change on the goldfish tank about every 5-6 days. The shrimp tank I do a 20% on the same day at the goldfish tank.

I too think it may be a nutrient deficiency. That is just my sense because the lights are in the low-med range.

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Here is one of the anubias in my goldfish tank:

anubias1_zpsca87a085.jpghttp://i1029.photobucket.com/albums/y357/LisaCGold/anubias1_zpsca87a085.jpg

Here is one of them in my shrimp tank:

Anubias2_zps012668b3.jpghttp://i1029.photobucket.com/albums/y357/LisaCGold/Anubias2_zps012668b3.jpg

Edited by LisaCGold

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That does look like a deficiency.

What are the water parameters for your tank? :)

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That does look like a deficiency.

What are the water parameters for your tank? :)

I agree.

And I don't think not enough light is the issue with the anubias. They have very little lighting needs, and IMHO the planted plus on a 29 gal should provide adequate light for that plant. Looks like a nutrient issue to me :idont

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That does look like a deficiency.

What are the water parameters for your tank? :)

That does look like a deficiency.

What are the water parameters for your tank? :)

Amm = 0, NO2 = 0, NO3 < 5

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That does look like a deficiency.

What are the water parameters for your tank? :)

I agree.

And I don't think not enough light is the issue with the anubias. They have very little lighting needs, and IMHO the planted plus on a 29 gal should provide adequate light for that plant. Looks like a nutrient issue to me :idont

I'm actually wondering if this might be a nitrogen issue, as the plants seem to be reabsorbing from the tip of the leaf, downward.

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That does look like a deficiency.

What are the water parameters for your tank? :)

I agree.

And I don't think not enough light is the issue with the anubias. They have very little lighting needs, and IMHO the planted plus on a 29 gal should provide adequate light for that plant. Looks like a nutrient issue to me :idont

If I decide to use the EI pack from GLA, do you think that the algae will experience a growth spurt? I'm thinking I should just give it a try.

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That does look like a deficiency.

What are the water parameters for your tank? :)

I agree.

And I don't think not enough light is the issue with the anubias. They have very little lighting needs, and IMHO the planted plus on a 29 gal should provide adequate light for that plant. Looks like a nutrient issue to me :idont

If I decide to use the EI pack from GLA, do you think that the algae will experience a growth spurt? I'm thinking I should just give it a try.

There are certainly different schools of thought on this, but to me, significant algae issues indicate imbalance in the tank . A planted tank is a balance between lights, ferts and co2. Light drives the balance (increased light = more demand for ferts/co2). If there is not enough ferts and co2 to balance the light you will actually see algae issues. Tom Barr has a lot of great articles on the relationship of algae and nutrients, but he essentially suggests that you need to focus on what will make the plants healthy, not what may or may not make the algae go away because if your plants are happy and healthy, then your tank will be balanced and the plants will thrive, not the algae.

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I agree that it appears to be a nutrient deficiency. I don't think this is caused by too much light. I have anubias coffeefolia in my 47 gallon with two T5 ho lights 78 watts total. Par puts my lights in the med to high range. My anubias is doing very well and has sprouted several new leaves in a couple months.

I read the anubias has been in the tank for a couple weeks? If so, the old leaves may be reacting to the new water conditions. A better indicator of your conditions will be the new leaves. But you will need some type of water column fertilization for the plants that feed from there, but it should be extremely minimal give low light and no Co2. You need to make sure all your elements are balances: light and nutrients. Can't have too much light in a tank that gets no ferts and no co2. Good luck!

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That does look like a deficiency.

What are the water parameters for your tank? :)

I agree.

And I don't think not enough light is the issue with the anubias. They have very little lighting needs, and IMHO the planted plus on a 29 gal should provide adequate light for that plant. Looks like a nutrient issue to me :idont

If I decide to use the EI pack from GLA, do you think that the algae will experience a growth spurt? I'm thinking I should just give it a try.

There are certainly different schools of thought on this, but to me, significant algae issues indicate imbalance in the tank . A planted tank is a balance between lights, ferts and co2. Light drives the balance (increased light = more demand for ferts/co2). If there is not enough ferts and co2 to balance the light you will actually see algae issues. Tom Barr has a lot of great articles on the relationship of algae and nutrients, but he essentially suggests that you need to focus on what will make the plants healthy, not what may or may not make the algae go away because if your plants are happy and healthy, then your tank will be balanced and the plants will thrive, not the algae.

I've been reading Tom Barr's website. Good point on focusing on getting plants healthy. I'll do that.

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I agree that it appears to be a nutrient deficiency. I don't think this is caused by too much light. I have anubias coffeefolia in my 47 gallon with two T5 ho lights 78 watts total. Par puts my lights in the med to high range. My anubias is doing very well and has sprouted several new leaves in a couple months.

I read the anubias has been in the tank for a couple weeks? If so, the old leaves may be reacting to the new water conditions. A better indicator of your conditions will be the new leaves. But you will need some type of water column fertilization for the plants that feed from there, but it should be extremely minimal give low light and no Co2. You need to make sure all your elements are balances: light and nutrients. Can't have too much light in a tank that gets no ferts and no co2. Good luck!

Thank you for this. I appreciate your insight. This supports what Jess and yafashelli have said. :)

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I ordered the EI pack of fertilizers from GLA. I plan to start with 1 dose per week (macro one day, micro the next). Do you think I need to do Excel also?

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I ordered the EI pack of fertilizers from GLA. I plan to start with 1 dose per week (macro one day, micro the next). Do you think I need to do Excel also?

Since you are not using co2 I would definitely dose Excel. You can dose macros and micros in the same day; however, if you dose iron, I've found it tends to be less effective when dosed with everything else. This may just be my tank though.

I noticed no one has mentioned flow yet. You will want to make sure you have adequate current to allow for better nutrient dispersal. At the moment I have my filter configured so the current moves in a clockwise fashion.

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I dose the macros and micros separately because the micro mix contains iron ;)

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I ordered the EI pack of fertilizers from GLA. I plan to start with 1 dose per week (macro one day, micro the next). Do you think I need to do Excel also?

Since you are not using co2 I would definitely dose Excel. You can dose macros and micros in the same day; however, if you dose iron, I've found it tends to be less effective when dosed with everything else. This may just be my tank though.

I noticed no one has mentioned flow yet. You will want to make sure you have adequate current to allow for better nutrient dispersal. At the moment I have my filter configured so the current moves in a clockwise fashion.

Thank you for this. I just purchased some Excel. I think there is enough flow in the tank, but I'll watch for this. Thanks again!

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Be sure to post if you have any questions!

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Be sure to post if you have any questions!

Thank you! I got the EI pack of fertilizers today. I should be getting the excel on Monday. Until then I've reduced the light time in my tank to slow down the need for ferts and co2. I've been reading on Tom barr's website about aquatic plants. Jeez, there is a lot to learn there about a low-tech planted aquarium. Especially if one wants to figure out how to keep most algae off the plants and to grow plants well, even the supposedly easy plants. I think some people have a setup in which the right balance of light, co2 levels, and nutrients was easier to come by. Not for me. I've had algae soon after I started. I liked the growth of algae on the tank walls, except the front wall of course. It's so pretty. Until the hairy brown algae came. That and the problem with the anubias gives me incentive to work on balancing things. I'm not out to get rid of all algae, mostly that hairy stuff.

My plan so far is: each time I do a water change (every 5 days or so), dose macros, gh booster, excel. Then next day, do micros to avoid insoluble ?? (I forget right now what Jess said and what I read on tom Barr's website). Anyway there is a good reason to dose micros a day after macros.

Since I have only marimo, Java moss, and anubias should I dose the macros/micros and excel between water changes? These plants don't need much, especially the marimo. I do have a sword but I use root tabs for that.

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I don't know about that particular line of products, but I will tell you that I change my water twice a week, and add in my ferts/excel component with each water change. Even though I've used this method for quite a while now, I still find that my anubias need to be bleached occasionally, for algae issues. I think that it's just the nature of the plant, because it such a slow grower, and the leaves can last for many years.

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