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Another Fish Another Problem

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  • Test Results for the Following:
    • * Ammonia Level(Tank) 0 - 0.25 ppm
    • * Nitrite Level(Tank) 0 - 0.25 ppm
    • * Nitrate level(Tank) 5 - 10 ppm
    • * Ammonia Level(Tap) 0 ppm
    • * Nitrite Level(Tap) 0 ppm
    • * Nitrate level(Tap) 5 - 10 ppm
    • * Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) 7.7
    • * Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) 7.6
  • Other Required Info:
    • * Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? API drops
    • * Water temperature? 76 F
    • * Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 20 gallon QT, 5 days
    • * What is the name and "size of the filter"(s)? Aqueon not sure of size
    • * How often do you change the water and how much? Every day 55%
    • * How many days ago was the last water change and how much did you change? Today 55%
    • * How many fish in the tank and their size? 1 approx 3 inches without tail
    • * What kind of water additives or conditioners? Prime
    • * What do you feed your fish and how often? NLS Goldfish Formula 2x a day
    • * Any new fish added to the tank? This is a QT for this fish
    • * Any medications added to the tank? No
    • * List entire medication/treatment history for fish and tank. Please include salt, Prazi, PP, etc and the approximate time and duration of treatment. 0.3% Salt since Saturday
    • * Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? Not that I can see.
    • * Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? Bottom sitting, spit out food

Hello again. This is about a new fish that I recieved from Rain Garden Goldfish on Friday. Apon arrival everything seemed fine except for what looks like a missing scale which you can see in the one photo. I started her in the QT and slowly raised the salt level to 0.3% on Saturday. Started to feed her on Saturday and she ate well. Yesterday I noticed some bottom sitting but she was still eating fine. Today she seems to be bottom sitting a lot more and after she ate tonight spit out some of her food. Because I am realatively new to this I wanted to see what you guys thought.

Thanks for your help.

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IMG_20130820_214823_086_zps917d1b88.jpg

IMG_20130820_215455_579_zps142478d2.jpg

IMG_20130820_214302_330_zpsf74529e5.jpg

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I'm not sure what could be wrong with her... A mod can probably suggest what it is when they get here. I hope she gets better soon! I love your goldies fins they are so pretty! Good luck!

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I got my 2 fish from raingarden and I know they were raised in ponds.mine were a bit timid when they first arrived

hoping for the best :)

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Someone more experienced can help, but those numbers are high so maybe that's it.. Really pretty fishy though :) Hope she gets better

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I'm not an expert but I am surprised you have nitrites and nitrates with a tank that has been only up for a few days. Did you use cycled media to get it started? Also, I would do a good water change because 0 ammonia and 0 nitrites is the best goal. I change my QT water every other day when the tank is uncycled. Also, every time I get a new fish, I keep the lights off on the tank for a few days to let them destress a little. You can also put a dark towel over part of the tank so the fish feels a bit more secure, helping reduce stress. I also try and put a bushy fake plant in there for the same reason. Not sure what is going on with your fish but it sure is cute!! Good luck!

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Definitely ideal to get those parameters down, particularly with salt, however if you've only just done a water change, the prime should have those detoxified in between changes. I would increase water changes as necessary in volume to get the parameters all down to 0ppm (with exception to your nitrates in tap) each water change, and as your pH will allow it, you shouldn't have any issues provided you match the temperature.

Are RG fish treated for flukes at all before being sold? If not, it's really not unusual for fish having large fluke infestations to show symptoms such as bottom sitting and lack of interest in food once treatment has begun; in this case the salt at 0.3%. Have you tried bloodworms for food?

Edited by Narny105

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Do you see much fin clamping, heavy breathing?

I would recommend treating for flukes with praziquantel, but it would be wise to have something like kanaplex (antibiotic) on hand just in case secondary infections set in.

For now, it is as others have said. Fish that are shipped sometimes need to de-stress. Give him/her a couple of days. Make sure at least part of the tank is covered, and pay attention to the poop, please.

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Yesterday I knew I had to go out after work so I didn't have time to do a water test but I at least wanted to do my daily water change. Later last night I decided to do a water test and to my surprise I was showing a reading slightly above zero in both ammonia and nitrite. After doing a 55% water change and using Prime, like you guys I was not expecting to see any readings, especially nitrite. I redosed with Prime and did another water test, which this time was zero on both ammonia and nitrite.

I actually have an empty cycled tank that contained my pond fish until very recently. However, I really wanted to follow Steve from Rain Garden's quarantine instructions. He wants a unused QT or one that has been bleached and then slowly add water from the fish containing tank to get the new fish used to possible pathogens. I could seed my QT filter with filter floss from my other tank but like I said I was concerned about possible pathogens.

Unfortunately my QT is not clear so it is a little hard to observe her. I have not really observed clamping or heavy breathing but I can only really observe her from above so it is tough to tell. I did notice this morning that she was swimming around until I turned on the desk light that I have over the tank. When I did this she swam to the bottom of the tank and just sat on the bottom. When I turned off the light she started swimming around again. The first few days I wasn't using this light but because the QT isn't clear I started using it the past couple of days to observe how she's doing. So maybe this is the reason for some of the bottom sitting all of the sudden. When I left for work today I didn't turn the light on and partially covered the tank with a towel.

Now that you ask she has been pooping a lot. It is pretty orange in color which is what I have observed previously in my other fish. I assume it is from the NLS I feed them.

Finally, my main concern right now is her spitting out her food right after she eats. I only have salt in the tank right now but as Narny suggested that might be causing irritation if she has flukes. I don't know if she was treated before she was shipped but I guess I should start treating her now just in case.

When someone has time can they suggest a treatment procedure. In the past I have treated for flukes in a cycled tank but since my QT isn't I will need a different procedure.

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I can't suggest anything but I hope your gorgeous fish gets past this! Very pretty :heart

Good luck!

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Thanks Jen. She is more yellow than in the pictures. Hopefully, when I get home tonight she is swimming around like crazy and then what I need to do next in her treatment.

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Hope your pretty Goldies feel better soon.

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Congratulations on your new rg fish. She/he is really cute. I love the yellow.

You might want to call RG and talk to Steve to let him know because your fish probably has some kind of guarantee and protocol. I'm not sure.

If not, I'll let a mod suggest some kind of routine/schedule for your fish. I know Alex has one for prazi. A seven day and five day round treatment if you use a filter. He has me on a schedule for my 20g no filter w/my new fish. It's a 100% daily water change w/meds added depending what day I'm on. It seems like a lot of work but my fish is doing great now. It was a slow start for close to a week because he wasn't interested in food either and was kind of bottom sitting also. I found out that he actually likes having a light on instead. He's more active. That's just my fish though.

I hope your fish gets to feeling better soon.

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Here is the evening update. She was a little afraid of me when I took the towel off her tank but seemed pretty active while I was changing water. I did notice the normal orange poo on the bottom of the tank and floating the not normal very long clearish poo. I am only mentioning this because Alex told me to keep an eye on it. I'm not sure what this means.

I was going to try to feed her some blood worms tonight but am holding off for now.

I did two large water changes and have added back the salt to 0.3%. If I want to treat with Prazipro should I do a single or double dose?

Thanks for the suggestions.

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You'd want to do a double dose of Prazipro.

I have gotten into the habit of recommending that when you treat for flukes, always have a broad spectrum antibiotic like Kanaplex around, just in case there are complications from secondary bacterial infections.

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Okay. I did a single dose last night and one this morning. I also ordered Kanaplex online.

I fed her some blood worms last night which she kept spitting out and then re-eating until they were gone. She seemed very hungry this morning so I soaked some pellets which she kept spitting back out. Do you think it is okay to continue to feed both the soaked pellets and the blood worms?

Also, because I am doing such large water changes everyday I was wondering how to proceed with the Prazipro treatment. Do I redose the full amount after each water change and how many days in a row do I dose before taking a break?

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Here is the evening update. She was pretty active when I got home and interested in eating. I fed her some blood worms since she seems to be able to eat them without spitting them out. I checked on her after dinner and she was bottom sitting not really moving at all. Also no poo in the tank today.

Todays water test

ammonia between 0 - 0.25 PPM

nitrite 0

I wasn't sure what to do so I decided to do a 100% water change then redosed with salt and prazi.

This is the second day I am adding prazipro I hope it is okay to keep redosing with it after daily water changes. I also wanted to know how many days in a row do I keep adding prazipro before I take a break.

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You are doing the right thing. Tomorrow is the last day you should Prazipro before taking a break.

I hope she perks up even more tomorrow. So far though, her behavior does support the idea that she has flukes. :(

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Another day of bottom sitting. Right now the only time I observe her moving around is when I feed her. I am starting to get a little concerned.

Today I will doing a big water change and addding salt. No Prazipro correct?

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You have the metronidazole and kanaplex?

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I was unable to find them locally so I ordered kanaplex online. Unfortunately it isn't supposed to arrive until Thursday. I can get Bifuran locally if you think I shouldn't wait.

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Go ahead and start the metro, please.

Do 400 mg/10 gallons, and check parameters daily. I would like for you to do 100% WCs every two days and redose.

Feed as usual.

Please update, and let me know when you've received the kana. :)

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The only thing I was able to find locally contains 250mg of metronidazole and 75mg of Praziquantel per packet. Is this acceptable to use?

Thanks for your help.

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This evening when I fed her the blood worms I noticed that she would do what I can only described as a twitching motion. This is something new that I haven't seen before.

I still have not put the metronidazole into the tank because I am concerned about the Praziquantel that is also include in these meds that I mentioned above.

I am really starting to freak a little here.

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Hi so sorry about your troubles. Personally, I'd be freaking too.

Beautiful fish in your pics!

Not sure what Alex will recommend for you, but I can reassure you Metro and Prazi are safe together. If you're concerned that Prazi already was present (apologies, trying to take it all in fast), there's a very wide safety margin with Prazi. It would be hard to give toxic levels unless you were trying hard to do so. In any case, risks from delaying needed meds are worse than any risks from these two meds

Very best wishes. Pulling for you both!

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Thanks Steve. I am pretty new to this. I have added the meds.

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