Hi! I love your forum and just registered because I need some serious advice. I have always loved fantail goldfish and have just recently finally gotten the right set up to start up my very first goldie tank. It is a 55 gallon tank with only two fantails in it. I completed a fishless cycle before adding the fish, and the ammonia and nitrites are at 0. I am keeping the nitrates at 20 ppms and below by doing a 20 percent water change weekly. I have two topfin 40 filters, and the temperature is staying between 66.5 and 70 degrees without a heater. When I added the fish a week and a half ago, the PH was at 7.2 - perfect for goldfish. Now, it has fallen to 6.4! The fish seem fine, and everything that I have read says not to add chemicals to buffer the PH, but isn't is even worse to keep goldfish in such an acidic tank?? Please tell me what I need to do!

Hello there, sounds like your fish have a nice cushy setup. You can use crushed coral to buffer the pH naturally. You can buy it at fish stores, just make sure to rinse it thoroughly. You can use it as gravel in your tank if it's big enough the fish won't eat it, or you can put it in a mesh/nylon bag in the filter. As the coral dissolves (very slowly) it will buffer the water and prevent the pH from dropping so much. I have it in my tank and it keeps the pH around 7.4.

I think that the advice not to mess with pH primarily applies to tanks with high pH and/or high KH (buffering capacity). Your KH must be pretty low for your pH to go down so dramatically.

I think most people have the most success with this product:
https://www.goldfishconnection.com/shop/det...44&catId=24

You should probably also get a test kit to monitor your KH (also available from Goldfish Connection).

Hi Ziggymom and Welcome to Koko's!

I was wondering how long it was between the test readings from 7.2 to 6.4? Falling pH usually means a low KH, as was stated.
Crushed coral and Buff It Up are both very good for keeping your pH stable, but until you get that in your tank, you should keep a close eye on your pH to make sure it won't get any lower.
You can add some baking soda to bring the pH up, adding 1 tsp at a time, until you get it to about 7. I would mix it in a cup in some tank water before adding it to the tank. Wait about 30 minutes between each teaspoon and test to see where the pH is.
You will still need to keep a close watch on the pH until you bring your KH up. A KH is a great idea, and you can bring a sample of water to your lfs and they can tell you what the reading is. It's best to have a test of your own though, so you can periodically test it yourself.

Best of luck with your fish!

Debbie

If your water is 7.2 out of the tap but it is falling to 6.4, it means that your KH is probably pretty low.

I would definitely use baking soda/crushed coral combo or get Buff it Up. Also get an API KH drop test kit.

Baking soda is very good at raising the pH but very poor at sustaining it, thus the need for crushed coral. Buff it up will raise and sustain the pH for the whole week thus negating the need to use crushed corals.

7.4 is the ideal pH for Goldies. 6.4 is 10x more acidic! 5.4 is 100x more acidic!! A tank with a pH drop from 7.2 to 6.4 is a pH crash waitin' to happen.

Thanks everyone! I tested again today and it had dropped all the way to 6.0! I did a 20% water change and brought it up to 6.4. Then, I added a low dose of PH up. I haven't tested it again at this point, but I think that is all I will do today, as too much of a fluctuation in PH is also supposed to be harmful. I also bought some 7.0 neutralizer which is supposed to stablize the PH at a neutral point. I was also thinking of using Easy Balance. It is supposed to stabilize PH, KH and absorb nitrates to keep the tank balanced. Has anyone ever used it?? You were all right about the KH level. I bought some test strips, and the level was 0! It didn't register at all! My fish seem totally oblivious to all of this and are as happy as can be! All they care about is food.

I don't mean to scare you, but I have heard bad things about pH Up. It has crashed pH in tanks in the past, and you really need to keep a VERY close eye on your pH level.
Crushed coral and Buff It Up are THE BEST ways of correcting your pH problem. The other products are just asking for trouble.
Keep checking the pH.

Debbie

baking soda is the cheapest way to keep the ph/kh. It is my choice but probably because I have to buffer my pond and to buy all that other stuff is waaaay to expensive. Cheaper is always better for me. After you keep track of what is going on in your tank you would know how much to add each week to keep it pretty stable, but doesn't negate the need for testing. Any change to the tank, ie adding another fish will change the chemistry and a new balance needs to be found.

Check your source water's kh as well to see what it is. Mine is close to zip out of the taps as well as in my pond and tanks. I usually don't have a problem in the tanks with the weekly water change.

KH is used by your filter in the ammonia/nitrite/nitrate cycle and that is why it goes down. Some types of filters in ponding seem to use more of it than others, don't know if that is true for different aquarium filters.

Ignorance is not bliss in this case. With your non-existant KH, your tank is a pH crash waitin' to happen. It has given you plenty of warnings with the slow decline all the way to 6.0. A pH crash by definition is when your water becomes 100X more acidic in a very short period of time. This can very easily kill your beloved wet pets. This means a drop of only 2 points on the pH scale.

I would not be messing around with those "wonder" products that raise the pH or whatever. You need to use the baking soda to raise the pH, and the crushed coral to sustain it. If money is not really a concern, use Buff it Up. It is hands down the best buffer on the market and it will sustain the pH rock steady for a week(which is the longest you should go between WC anyway).

The ideal pH for Goldies is 7.4. If you are going to err one way or another, it is much better to go on the higher side. I usually aim for 7.6.

While true, don't worry about precision on pH - stability is much more important. Goldfish can get used to just about anything from 7.0 to low 8s or maybe higher. Whats most important is that it doesn't change a lot and that your KH is reasonably high (which are kinda the same thing anyway).

If you have a low pH and you are raising it, there is not reason why you shouldn't aim for the perfect pH. It is not that difficult, once you get the hang of it. My water is 6.8 out of the tap, I use buff it up, and I do everything by feel and memory now, no measuring whatsoever and I always hit the 7.6 mark everytime.

Your advice is valid if someone has a high pH, for example 8.2 or something like that. Then I wouldn't bother trying to lower it. I would just leave it the way it is.

Wow, you were right. I just tested again and the PH has crashed so much that it doesn't even register. I was trying to use products that I could buy at the local nnnn instead of having to order online, and the only one that said it would hold a steady level was the 7.0 neutralizer. That was why I bought that one. I surely didn't think that the PH up wouldn't even hold it for a day! I thought it was better to raise it slowly, then stabilize it. I just ordered the Buff it up. I looked for the crushed coral last night too, but didn't see any. All we have around here is nnnn. There are no aquarium stores at all. I will try again today to stabilize it enough to last until I get my delivery. I have had other kinds of freshwater fish in tanks, but have never really had any luck. In the past, I have had my water to test perfectly in every respect and fish just died one right after another. At one point, I even took some of the water to an aquarium store when I lived in Atlanta. They tested it and said it was perfect. They questioned me about my setup, the temperature, what I was feeding them...everything. They could find no reason why I killed approximately 8-10 fish in a one month period. On the other hand...my sister has two tanks and a pond in her yard. She is one of those people who never tests the water, only changes it every couple of weeks or so, and her fish live for years!

I have always wanted goldfish, but maybe this wasn't such a good idea. Oh well, I have grown attached to the little guys, so I will press on. I hope that I don't kill them! I blame my husband. He named one of them Mr. Boobles. The poor guy was doomed with a name like that!

Get the fishes out of that acid bath immediately!! Do a 100% water change. Use the baking soda to raise the pH.

I added one teaspoon of baking soda, and it immediately raised it to 7.2! It has held that PH for 6 hours now, and I just fed the little guys. It certainly hasn't effected their appetite. The smaller one, Ziggy, was having to fight Mr. B for his food, so he has now started eating right out of my hand! I have never seen a fish do that! He was eating really close to the bottom, and I was making sure that he got some food, but this time he swam all the way up to the top and took a piece of food right from my hand. I am home recuperating from surgery, so luckily I can keep an eye on the PH and add the baking soda and the buff it up when I get it, but my husband is having to do the water changes now, because I am not allowed to lift more than 5 lbs. for another month! I can't lift the buckets of water to put into the tank. He is doing really well though. I will keep everyone posted. I am feeding them the pro gold sold on this website, along with shelled peas twice a week. I also tried some romaine lettuce, but they didn't seem to understand what the veggie clip was. I think that I will try making some gel food next. Thanks to everyone for all of your suggestions. I need all the help I can get!

What kind of pH test kit do you have?

I now have two. I am using an API Freshwater test kit, and I just bought some API test strips. I like the test kit that you actually collect the water and drop the solution into better. It is more work, but seems to be more accurate.

Yeah the strips are no good. The drop kit is excellent. How low did your pH go?

It was pale yellow....at the lowest end of the spectrum at 6.0. I figure that means that it could be much lower than that, since it had been falling so rapidly. The test doesn't go any lower, so I really don't know.

My guess is that it was probably right at 6.0 because if it was any lower, your goldies would have been in total distress. Your goldies also sound very hardy as many more sensitive ones would have shown signs of distress at 6.0.

Keep a sharp eye on your pH.