Test Results for the Following:

I have ordered a new test kit, so can't tell you results at the moment!

Tank size (How many Gals)? 24" x 12" x 15" so roughly 18ish us gallons I think?

How long has it been running? years, but goldfish only been in for a couple of weeks

What is the name and size of the filter/s? I had a fluval 2+ but I swapped it for a QuickSand fluidized filter today. It's suitable for up to 60 gallon tanks. Uk gallons I think??

How often do you change the water and how much? Usually 1/3 each week.

How many fish in the tank and their size? 2 x 2" ryukin/fantails, 2 x lemon tails, 1 small pleco.

What kind of water additives or conditioners? Tetra easy balance and water safe guard.

Any medications added to the tank? no

Add any new fish to the tank? 2 apple snails

What do you feed your fish? Hikaria Oranda food

Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt", boody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? no

Any unusual behavior like staying t the bottom, not eating, ect..? One was sat on top of the filter a little bit, and they have both been a bit less active so I've increased the airation and done a small water topup. Should I do a water change or am I just being paranoid?!

Water change is highly recommended especially since you can't test right now. You've got five fish in a 18 gallon tank changing only 1/3rd of the water a week. It's a safe bet that if nothing else your water is bad.

I agree, the most likely issue is water quality problems - this could be anything from inadequate filtration for the bioload with Ammonia and NitrIte spikes occuring to the water being heavily loaded with NitrAtes, in any case the best thing to do right now is change the water (dechlorinated/same temperature).

Can you take a sample of the water to your local fish store to have it tested and post the results back here?

In the meantime, personally I'd do at least a 50-75% water changes to freshen things up and see if that changes their behaviour - although it would be easier to interpret the problem with test results in hand.

I'm not familiar with the filter you've changed to, how does that work? Did you "transfer" the cycle? In other words use the old filter media to "seed" the new filter - otherwise your tank may be re-cycling?

The other issue is that as you've recently changed from tropicals to goldies the filter beneficial nitrifying bacteria may not yet be established enough to deal with the increased waste of goldfish - again the solution for that is to test the water regularly, change more water more often and make sure the filter is adequate to deal with the bioload of the tank. As Ryukinluver also says - it may also be a stocking/water volume issue too. See if you can get some test results and post back soon, otherwise I'd start by doing a large water change. Good move to increase the aeration as that will help to promote adequate oxygenation of the tank

I've done a 50% water change now with dechlorinated water. They are both still swimming around the top. Although not breathing from the surface. Roughly 1 or 2cm below the surface :S

Hopefully I should get my test kit sometime this week. Should I keep doing water changes each day?

It's a sand filter, but I haven't seeded it.. I did leave the old filter in but when one fish sat on top of the other pump I was worried the flow was too much for them to cope with so I removed it. Is my tank recycling then?

Weirdly one fish is a lot more active than the other..

Thanks for all your help

Mattheau, I am not familiar with sand filters at all, so I don't know if you would be able to add any extra media to it. If there is space left, put some of the media from your old filter in it, that will seed the sand filter instantly. If there isn't any space, just squeeze the old media with all the gunk out and into the sand filter: same effect = instant seeding.

Until the test kits arrive, yes, it would be best to do daily water changes, just to be on the save side. And just like humans, fish have different personalities and querks. Some are more robust, while others are more sensitive. That's why one of your fish seems to be more unfaced by the issues going on than the other.

Keep us posted on their troubles.

I'm not at all familiar with sand filters, in fact I've never heard of them before - as I'm not really sure how they work in terms of biological filtration, so I can't comment on that although I'd say that if it is brand new and you've removed the old established filter - you've probably taken out the existing colony of beneficial bacteria - so your tank may well be recycling. We need test results to confirm that.

That can be OK as long as you're testing the water daily (Ammonia, NitrIte, NitrAte and pH) and changing the water regularly to keep Ammonia and NitrIte levels to a minimum as the cycle proresses through those stages.

I'm jsut wondering if your tank is also already laoded with NitrAtes too.

If it was me, I would probably be changing water daily for now and then when you get your test kit you can be guided by the results. In th absence of any other symptoms - I'd say that water quality is proably the cause of their behaviour, but keep a close eye on them.

By the way, any idea what your tap water water pH is or what your last tank water pH was? Hopefully, somebody can offer you some more advice soon

Edit: Posted at same time as Andrea! I was just off to PM her for you too!

Great minds think alike, hm?

I'm a slow typer!

Can't add any more medium to it. A sand filter is the same thing as a fluidized filter. Basically a tower of sand that water is passing through constantly.

Stupidly I've already cleaned the old filter

They seem a little livelier after the water change and adding an airpump. Hopefully they'll be okay. They are both eating, which I think's positive

Probably best to treat it as cycling tank now then - test water daily, and water change according to test results to keep ammonia and nitrIte levels to a minimum, could take 4-6 weeks to cycle. On the plus side as you've upgraded the filter your fish should benefit from that in the end. Let us know how you get on

Thankfully they look a lot better now. Although producing some very long stools. So I don't think I'm going to feed them tomorrow.

Is this advisable?

It doesn't usually hurt to have a fasting day every week - that's what many of us do anyway. The other thing is that reduced/careful feeding is advised during cycling anyway in order to keep the water quality as good as possible between water changes

Okay I wont feel too guilty about starving them tomorrow then!

I hadn't mentioned that the water is slightly milky, but after searching the forum I see that's because it's still cycling. I couldn't understand why it wasn't disappearing with water changes and my filter..

It seems I still have a lot to learn

yeah, it is a gradual learning process... But it'll be beneficiary for the fish, and it makes the hobby much more enjoyable after jumping over those first hurdles.

Well my test kit came today! It's a strip test if that makes any difference...

Nitrate - 50 mg/l
Nitirite - 0 mg/l
16'D> - GH
6'D - KH
7ish - PH

Not sure what that means?

The water seems a little clearer today. The fish are also a lot livelier, and I haven't fed them.

Should I still do a water change? Thanks again for all your help guys!

Strips are OK, drop test kits are generally better (more accurate) - but at least you can check your parameters so that's good.

Have you got a reading for Ammonia? That will be the most important one since your tank will be cycling now and your fish will be producing ammonia that won't be being broken down by the biological filter yet.

NitrIte reading is fine since your tank has started to recycle since yesterday, you wouldn't usually expect to see a reading yet.

NitrAtes could do with coming down. We usually say to try to keep NitrAtes no more than 40-50 mg/l with goldfish.

I suspected your tank was probably already loaded with NitrAtes as you went from tropicals to goldies and are changing only a thrid per week. Did you do a very large water change before you first introduced your goldies?

Can you test your tap water too? That will tell us whether you have any nitrAtes already in your tap water (not uncommon and a pain).

Ideally, we aim to keep nitrAtes levels as low as possible(0, but 5-10i s a common running levels and you have to take into account your tank is fully stocked up) to promote optimum fish health in a closed environment. You have some live plants, right? That will help to use up some, but not all.

If I were you I would keep water changing for the next few days to get those NitrAtes right down. That will be a good starting point.

Each time you do a water change the nitrAtes are reduced by that amount (for example if your nitrAtes are 50 mg/l now and you change another 50% now, your nitrAtes will be diluted to 25 mg/l and so on and so on). Therefore, If I were you - I'd change 50% daily for the next few days to get the nitrAtes right down. Also test daily, to ensure you keep the ammonia and nitrItes right down as you pass through the cycling stages.

Your pH is fine for goldies, I make your Gh (water hardness) around 280 mg/l which is moderately hard water and your Kh (buffering capacity to keep pH stable) over 100 mg/l which is good.

Harder water, usually has a corespondingly higher Kh and pH. Your ph is a little lower than I would of thought (double check?) based on the Gh and Kh - but it's stable enough. Can you test your tap water for pH, Gh and Kh too? Write those down - it's good to have a baseline reading for tap water vs tank water.

Hope all that helps! Basically - test the water daily, change enough water to keep ammonia, nitrIte and nitrAtes as low as possible (particularly the first two during cycling), keep an eye that the pH doesn't flutuate and you can't go to far wrong!

Tap Water Stats:

Nitrate - 0 mg/l
Nitirite - 0 mg/l
GH - 16'D>
KH - 6'D
PH - 7.2-7.6ish

I think I just did a 1/3 change when I added the goldfish. The PH on the first test may have been a little higher. It's quite hard to tell. When the strips run out I will get a drop test

Going to do a 50% water change now. I'm going away at the weekend for two or three days. Is there anything I can do to ensure it goes smoothly?

OK, well tap waters good too.

Did you maange to get a tank water ammonia reading by the way?


If it were me - give them a very small feed tomorrow (since you starved them today), I'd change another 50-75% tomorrow before you go, that should get your nitrAtes down a bit more, dilute any ammonia and freshen the water up and don't have them fed by anyone over the weekend while you're away. Test the water again as soon you get back and change as much water as necesary to keep them good. If it's only a couple of day it may be OK, although all's the better if anyone can test the water and change it while you're away (to keep harmful ammonia as low as possible, that's the real risk in a cycling tank while you're away) Hope that helps

Yesterday the tank was looking perfect. This morning I found Sid dead and the tank looking a state. I think he got stuck next to one of the logs and fouled the water

Anyway I did a HUGE waterchange and went off to work!!

Going on holiday now for three days, so I'm just going to have to keep my fingers crossed. Hopefully everything will be alright, especially now there's less fish in there.


RIP Sid

Sorry you lost Sid

While the tank is cycling you need to keep testing the water and changing as much water as necessary to keep Ammonia and NitrItes as low as possible. Is there anyone that can do that for you while you're on holiday? Again, don't have them fed for three days.

On the plus side with all the water changes your running nitrAte level must be a lot lower now? What are the latest test resuts and have you got one for ammonia now?

Just got back from my break. Surpisingly the water seems to be great! I suppose that's because I haven't fed them since Sunday though. Gave a feeding just before. The fish still seem hungry so might feed a little more later.

These are my results:

Nitrate - 10 mg/l
Nitirite - 0 mg/l
GH - 16'D>
KH - 6'D
PH - 7ish

I haven't done a water change or bought an ammonia test yet I'm afraid.

The nitrAte reading may be the residue amount left in your tank from when the amounts were higher and you changed it out - it may not mean you have a fully functing cycle yet (although those nitrAtes are a lot healthier for goldies than before). It's very important to test the ammonia at this stage so as soon as you can I'd certainly recommend geting an ammonia test kit. In the absence of an ammonia kit at this stage in cycling, I'd continue to feed sparingly and do regular large water changes in order to dilute right down any ammonia present

Done some more tests today:

Nitrate - 25 mg/l
Nitirite - 1 mg/l
GH - 16'D>
KH - 6'D
PH - 6.8

Looks pretty good to me

I have done my first water change today since the massive change last weekend. Still unable to get an ammonia test kit unfortunately.

Since Sid died I've noticed a lot of my plants grow much better. I think it shows who's nibbling my plants!! The floating plants had no roots left and now a week later some are nearly 3" long.

Is your nitrIte 1mg or 0.1mg?

Try to keep any nitrIte level as low as possble during cycling - again, an ammonia test may be telling particularly a couple of weeks into a re-cycle, with a nitrIte reading showing as well - you may be having ammonia spikes (there's a cross-over between the two) and that's the most harmful. Personally, I'd continue to change the water regularly to keep any ammonia or nitrIte diluted right down. Although your tank is probably re-cyling due to the filter swap, it was also probably somewhat seeded with some beneficial bacteria already (water, gravel, ornaments etc.) so that's helped to speed things up.


Again, sorry you lost Sid

Mattheau, the other fish are doing fine this days? I am sorry about Sid..

Growing plants are good news however...

This weeks set:

Nitrate - 10 to 25 mg/l
Nitirite - 0 mg/l
GH - 16'D>
KH - 6'D
PH - 6.8

I think the tank's quite settled now. The fish are doing great and the plants are really shooting up. Going to try and get a photo soon.

Weirdly I had a dream last night that my pleco attacked my goldfish. He hasn't done, I must have fish on the brain!! lol

<img src="http://photos-b.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-sctm/v115/122/42/283800070/n283800070_191929_9391.jpg" width="300">

<img src="http://photos-b.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-sctm/v115/122/42/283800070/n283800070_191929_9391.jpg" width="300">

Third time lucky

That is a pretty neat setup, especially with the white sand. Are you doing any plant fertilizing? Looks nice... My multiple attempts of a planted goldfish tank all ended in the same disaster - the plants looked like the leftovers of a salad bar after lunch time in a all-you-can-eat buffet...