Ok im sorry i dont have the readings in full but i did a quik water test revealed there was hi alkaline in the water higher than whats said to be safe levels.......they ahve white grainy sand like granules all over there fins and some on there bodies my eldest fish bubbles has passed away i admit it is extrmely dirty tank alot of poop and the filter hasnt been replaced for months due to having heavy job coimmitments and not enough time!!! i know your all gana blame me but please dont i feel bad for bubbles deatha nd im tellingmyself he was old and he had a good life of 6 years....i have salt to give thema bath and i have a spare small fish tank to quarantine them. the guy said he reckons its called 'white spot' and gave me soemthign called 'white spot remedy' Should i take them out fo this poorly maintained tank and put them in this small tank together and salt bathe them first overnight or put some of the white spot remedy in with them........PLEASE HELP ITS URGENT!!! the fantails tails are starting to shred into strings at the tips bubbles tail had this to the other new fish i introduced quikly to the tank is a blackmoor i think small one with dual fins at back and a dorsol fin he seems to ahve it to though not as bad and he is swimming around more and is more active


PS PLEASE HELP!!!

Ive put them ina clear tank no rocks nothing just a tankw ith water its about 17 litres so a little over 4 gallons which is small i know but its a small tank for hospital purposes for overnight till i can deep clean my big tank tommorrow. I have put in white spot remedy around 55 drops and have placed both fish in the tank the sick and the not so sick thoughhas a few ick on him... so they can heal together im going to also salth bath them tonight wish me luck!

Hi tomk and

Firstly, I wouldn't move them as the ich will still be present in the original tank so treating both fish and tank is the most successful way of getting rid of them.

By the sounds of things you may need to step up waterchanges ie. 50% daily for the next little while and vacuuming the gravel extensively. Vacuuming the gravel also removes any of the cysts that fall off your fish. The most effective method for treating ich (and the safest), is with salt and the way to do this is:

Add 1 teaspoon of sea, rock or aquarium salt per gallon predissolved

Then 12 hours later, add another 1 teaspoon of salt per gallon

Then 12 hours later - the same again.

The thing that can cause ich is stress because once the immunity is lowered, this parasite takes hold, and quickly.

As for your filter, just rinse the filter media out thoroughly in old tank water so as not to disturb the beneficial bacteria.

Have you a heater you can use? Raising the temps to 82 degrees speeds up the parasite's cycle but you don't want to heat the water until you have reached a salt level of 0.3%.

The most important thing in all this is improving their living conditions so waterchanges is important.

Hope this helps

Thanks for your help!!!!! Jen W im still a newb at this i have basic knowledge but the other day i had to put this blackmoore or what ever it is into the biger tank because my sister had it as a unwanted birthday pet in this really really small round (i wouldnt even call it a tank!) bowl! and it wast moving around becuase no airation either just plasnt i put the fish in immeditalet almost ( besides putting it in its own tank water in polastic bag and putting in my bigger tank then releasing him all seemed fine till day-2 days later when i walked past n saw all this on them my bubbsy didnt last long and im afraid the current goldy will die to! i guess its a good sign because some of the white spots are on the boittom of the hospital tank. as for my bigger tank i will treat it to what do you suggest! this will take forever!!!!! it has driftwood in it a ornament and yes a heater that i put to about 70 heatwise...and theres mould all over everything and when i stir the water with my hand rapidly it kicks up alot of poo the test revealed alot of alkaline in it.....i know you must think im an animal and i am not and i loved my fishies dearly and my 2 fish that are left out of 3 i am trying my best justb that work takes over life sometimes....


ps forgive me for my bad typing im trying to learn speed typing

ok guys an update on fish he looking a little better all his fins are just lifeless and not extended out and his side fins are curled under.... he is sitting at bottom of the tank but still sitting level which im assuming is alright im leavint hem in ghits 16 litre tank for next 3 days giving them a 50 percent water change every day. and a salt bath every 12 hours with one table spoon of saly morter and pessled and then disolved in hot water. I have thrown the plants out that i introduced... and i have put literally quarter of the remedy in my fish tank so its coated i will allow 3 days for it to soack into everything and then in 3 days i will deep clean the big tank thourougly washing stuff with vinager. what do you think sounds like a plan its already underway im keeping a towel over the tank and airation stone in it no filter becuase i believe the filter will just counter react with the mideicine... and salt... and it wouldbe pointless i see some of his dead tail falling off and ive see some spots on the bottom of the tank that i have cleaned up. Should i feed them some Peas? will that keep them healthy and will it be alright to feed them in the salted and medicined water? please help thanks guys n gals!

Hi tom, if you're using meds then I would forgo using salt.

Ich if treated correctly can be easily dealt with and when I read what you have to go through, I can't help but think you're just making more work for yourself, plus if you shut down your filter, you will most likely lose all your good bacteria and crash your cycle.

When I had an outbreak of ich i simply took it one step at a time.

1- I added the first teaspoon per gallon (salt)
2- 12 hours later, i did the same again
3- 12 hours later, the final addition of salt - 1tsp per gallon
4- Once i had my salt level to 0.3%, I added the heater and raised my temp to 82degrees
5- I vacuumed the gravel daily and replace the salt I removed in the water removed

Then I waited.

I didn't strip down my tank or turn off my filters - I didn't have to. And this is why treating with salt is the simplest and most gentle way of doing it. There's no damage to your good bacteria and the salt is gentle on your fish.

Most ich meds contain malachite green so keeping the lights off while treating is important otherwise the meds are rendered ineffective.

This is how I would have tackled it

wish you were here lol his sitting there not doing much n his poor fins are shreded at the tips.... i have a proper water testing kit how do i tell when i have 0.3 percent salt in his water..... i do have a heater that is really dirty in current tank that i will clean out in 3 days i had poored so much of spot remedy in big tank just to let it soack on everything till 3 days l;ater when i will beable to deap clean and pour vinegar in it i know im creating alot of work for me but i have weekend off so i can spend time on it as for the filters jen the pet shop guy said dont use my certain filter becuase it has a 2 pad system ones the white pad and the other is the black coal rocks or what ever they are that slide into it. he suggested strongly not to use it coz it will counter react with the remedy i have he said just an air stone and this should cure it. It does look like it has less of the Ich on it now though who knows hopefully he will hold out.... i did a clean today bout 28 percent of the tank empties and reapplied new water and then another teaspoon of salt. im praying it makes it... i also have the new fish in with him coz it has some ich on it to. and the black fishy is swimming around more and seems better and wil make it definately but the goaldis tails like i said are shredded on the tips there just fine spaghetti strands... and side fins are curled under and top is down flat with his back. What do you reckon....i wish i could take pictures but cant at moment.

Ps thanks for responding! where is everybody!!! not many peeps on the site

Yes, i'm in Australia and it's only 8.30pm - and I think our American friends are getting ready for bed...

Now, would you be able to clear up my confusion? Do you have your fish in salt? or in meds? Or do you just have the big tank in meds?

I understand why you can't run your filter with the meds - because you have carbon built into your filter pads. Do you have any aquaone filter? ie.



top view:



I have 2 of these filters running on my quarantine tank and they both came with an all in one pad/carbon and i removed them to make the filter work better both biologically and mechanically. I inserted noodles at the back to house good bacteria and inserted sponges in the front to remove any waste and now they actually work well at filtering. If you have one of these, then you could make it work better for you.

So, would you be able to run me through the treatment of your sick fish... are they in meds or salt? They shouldn't be in both because salt and malachite green don't mix well and will just place additional stress on your fish.

If your fish are in both, then this could be the reason his fins are shredding and he's doing poorly. Do you want to know what I would do? I would start from the beginning and put the meds back in your medicine cabinet. Then I would just go with salt as i explained above. AND, I would treat your fish in the main tank and run the filters to keep the good bacteria alive - that way your outbreak and treatment are contained and salt is all you need to resolve it.

Your fish are exhibiting signs of bad stress so the gentlest cure would be the best no? Don't worry about stripping down your tank - just treat the entire tank and fish at the same time and keep the salt up for 10 days after you see the last of the ich. How do you know how much salt is in the tank? Basically you need to keep a careful track of how much you add to your water. 1 teaspoon per gallon at 3 separate intervals isn't hard to monitor. The first addition gives you 0.1%, then 12 hours later - the second addition gives you another 0.1% taking your to 0.2%. Then the 3rd takes you to a grand total of 0.3% - enough to destroy ich.

I hope this all makes sense

thanks alot jen w you are making sense but! its to late i work long days 10 sometimes 12 hours a day at my work and i come home buggered this will be a big job which i will do in 2 days time.... i am currently trreating both with meds and salt.... his fins were shredded before i placed him in there but not the red parts just the white ends (which the white makes up most of his end tail.......i do see it working somehow though becuase i have palced him in with just water no gravel etc i can see everything taht has fallen off him......so you suggest.....i put only salt in????? even though this is a remedy especially made to cute ich..... as fopr the bigger tank not only is it a job and a half and will take hours becuase im buggerd not only that but because I have literally poured 100s of drops of this remedy into the bigger tank im soaking it for 3 days to improve the tanks condition to....the tank doest not look good at all and i admit it is because im always to busy... and i know i must take time aside on days off to improve the tank.....i have driftwood in the tank also which before i put in years ago like 4-5 years ago i did soack it for a few days.... and scrub and soak to make sure the contaminations did not occur.....I am now thinking of ditching the drift wood...it is the first thing to get mossy... and its a real pain to clean you can never get 100 percent clean......I think my fish is getting better he is taking better looking breaths in my point of view and i do see ich on the bottom of the small 4 gallon hospital tank.

I have almost exactly the same filter as you to probably the same it does 200litres an hour or as it says on its blue box. its product name is "Aqua One H-200 series (im guessing coz it does 200 litres per hour they called it that )

thanks alot for replying Jen and taking the time to reply to my posts! its very much appreciated

Ps im in Australia to GO SYDNEY!!!!


Cheers Tom.

PPS: i apologise for the bad grammar in my english....i have not read a book in a longgggggggg time

Hi Tom,

Another Sydneysider?

---------------------------

I just want to add the only problem with medicating your tank for 3 days is some of the ich cysts may take a week to hatch and while they're in the cyst stage, they're inpenetrable. So the meds won't do much damage to those i'm afraid. That's why salt is so good, it kills them and you can keep it in your tank for 4 weeks with no damage.

Salt and some meds are a big no, no so try to remove one or the other - and just think, if you spend one day on it, you can leave it for another few days

I hope they come through this and keep us posted.

PS. You have the same aqua one filter I have (in the pic) so if you want to make it work better for you, try adding some sponge and noodles - the filter would work much better for you.

PPS. If the filter is off, you've crashed your cycle anyhow so maybe now would be a good time to soup up your filter <hint, hint>

lol! thanjks again jen fun talking you on this hehe,

I have never ever kept a cycle going i have to read it and then its so much work to keep the cycle going thats why im getting rid of the driftwood so the cycles dont have to be so tight together that driftwood is bad news its a cleaners worst nightmare as for the noodles i found a website but they were out of stock (theaquariumshop.com.au) do you suggest any other kool sites to buy off im starting to get back into fish but my bigger tank is still small... i mean tis a good size to keep them and now that my eldest fish passed away 2 days ago theres 2 small fish which should still be alright for the time being until i move out of parents house and find own place ina few years that is when i plan on buying a 650-700 dollar tank and stand thinking about 150 litres .

As for the meds i have done a 50 eprcent water change everyday preety much after work on this 16-18 litre tank and by now i believe most of the med has gone there is stilla blue tinge but as i keep doing water change daily for next couple of days it mostly will be salt left..... his tails are shredded it cant mean fin rot is it common for there tails to sred at the tips right up to the orange muscle. Its kidna ahrd to explain the white bits of the tail are shredded into thin hair strands and its orange scale/muscle bit that wings them is still fine and some of the white fins at the base his side fins are curled under still and top on is always down....this is usual for ich????

Sorry for always typing so much just i usually like to be very certain!. (im one of those people who for some reason always tripple checks things like the back door is locked before i go to work )

Cheers Tom.

PS. Any good sites recommended in australia that you are aware of that are good reliable and can take Direct Deposit ( I dont have mastercard or visa yet )

PPS i have baught some freeze Dried wardleys Blood worms for my fishies to help them get better coz i herd there good for them and im buyign a 75 centimetre bendy air hose... and a megnetic cleaner for the glass tank

I don't actually buy online (except for eBay ) as I get most of my pet supplies from Petbarn. To give you an example, I can get a large bottle of Aquarium Science Antibacterial meds for $6.95 and my local aquarium sells the same stuff for $29.50

Also another tip, if you want to get a really good and big tank for a decent price, keep your eyes out on ebay. There's a lot of good local deals going and I just purchased another 60 gallon (250 litres) with stand (threw the hood out as i don't like 'em), Eheim canister filter and incredible M2K3 air pump (sells for $135 at my local) and all for $175. So really, watching can get you a good bargain

Just on your fish, try to keep up the salt if the meds have been removed because you need to have it at 0.3% to destroy and hatched cysts.

PS. You can keep a cycle going forever, it's not hard to do. Just make sure your filter is good enough to be able to house good bacteria and it does all the work for you. Cycling IMHO is the easiest thing to maintain once your tank has cycled. It will always remain that way unless you crash it for some reason so I highly recommend keep a good filter and letting it keep your water for you.

yes i can keep a cycle besides the fact that that drift wood really gets mould growing back within days.... i see patches reoccuring!!! plus it takes up alot of the tank..... so im gana take it out let it ddry for when i get a bigger tank and a external filter there awesome those noodles galore in them and carbon fibre galore anyways i opened filter the other day after like 4 months not cleaning (i know you think im an animal just never have time) and Oh my dear lord the crap that was in the filter i therw it immediately and baught 3 refresher cartridges from hi tech aquariums ( there really good!) manly aquarium sux

As for ebay hmmmm i never trust that place ive herd so many bad stories about it....if your lucky enough have a good sale then you have to worry about the product being garunteed to have no scratches or no cracks or no problems

Well being a seasoned veteran of all things ebay, it's not so difficult. If i watch a tank and want to know what condition it's in i simply send a message to the seller. Then if I go to pick the item up and it's a case of "item as not described" - you don't have to take the it but this has never happened to me and on the whole, most sellers are honest

As for Hi Tek - I visit that place nearly every weekend without fail. I buy most of my items from them but they are a bit pricey. I visited Manly Aquariums a couple of weeks ago and it didn't leave a lasting impression on me.

If you're using the aqua one filter, as it comes, then you'll always have problems with your cycle because the media is dismal and all in one so when you replace the pads, you basically throw your good bacteria in the bin and your tank goes through a cycle all over again. That's why I shoved mine full of good media so i only need to rinse the sponges and the tank remains cycled. They're not my favouite filters at all but I got them as part of a package with a 10 gallon and 20 gallon (hospital tanks). So you can make them work better for you

same haha i baught one those little plastic tanks came with the filter worth almot 40 bucks alone ina 30 dollar package from hi tech! there champs! i love going there and since expanding theres more to look at i love that smell of wood and warmness in where all there fishies are i love that place im willing to pay the extra buck to get the stuff i dont mind but i do enjoy going there as for manly! i know already said dont liek them but my mate said the owner there who works there to old man is really rude... and he isnt very helpful he seems to want a sale more than actually give you advice and they dont know anywhere near as much as hi tech aquarium staff .

Anyways this is going off topic on topic his still breathing so i guess its a good sign..... im going to give hima salt bath again tonight am i supposed to change 50 percent water for example i know its a small tank but for example if i wasnt to cyhange the water does the salt builkd up or disipate in the tank so if i wasnt to change any water and keep adding every 12 hours teaspoon of marine salt would it build up? stupid question i know but science can be very weird sometimes!:o

Cheers Tom

Not a stupid question! I did not know the answer to it until I came here either.

Salt does not disipate at all, the only way to remove it is to do water changes. So you do not want to add any more salt after your correct level is reached unless you do a water change, then you want to add back whatever you replace. If you are trying to get to a certain percentage and adding it slowly over twelve hours, then you would just keep adding it, it will build up. So if you are trying to get to .3 % you would add 1 teaspoon per gallon, then 12 hours later add that same amount, then 12 hours later add that same amount. If you do water changes in between you will need to replace the salt you took out.

It can get tricky, but what I do is I add salt to each bucket I am putting back in. So if I am salting to .1% (1 teaspoon per US gallon) and I am adding 3 gallons back into the tank, I put the three teaspoons of salt into the bucket and add that water. Then if I do another bucket I add the salt to it. Does that make sense? Sometimes computing percentages can get tricky so i do it that way, because too much salt can hurt the fish. Hope I didn't confuse you further!

Hope that helps!

What the hel!!!! ARRRR i need help baddly all thats left on his twin rear fins is his orange scales n muscle his ends (The white fairer bits) are totally shredded!!!! will his fins regrow?????????? just like say nail tips to????

Will his tail grow back hi white tail ends which is majority of his tail have all gone except the scaley orange muscle that connects to them... he can still manage to swim around though and is more active now.... i have added my Aqua noe H-200 filter to this small tank so the water quality should be improved by like 450% because its sucha small tank water is being cycled like crazy and the air stone still going.... im still putting salt in and stopped using my remedy White spot.... He is more active now he still has the ich on his scales more now because his tails have falledn off wondering if his tail tips will grow back e.g like our nails grow back? or should i put him down now and not bother letting him live....I know it sounds crued just looking out for his quality of life!

Cheers Tom

They can grow back - but even if not - he will still be able to get around. The main thing here is fixing the underlying problem.

Do you still have salt at 0.3%
Is his water still perfect?
Does he still have ich?

Tom, i've just answered your other post and will merge the 2. All the information is kept in one making it easier to follow

ROFL YOU ONLY ONE PREETY MUCH ANSWERS MY QUESTIONS thanks again ummmm salt i stil been adding every 12 hours about 3 quarters ofa teaspoon flat with spoon... he does still have some ich patches on his scales.. and on top of his fin on his top that little one... see does seem to be moving around more though and the filter thing i added last night thoguht might as well get 200 litres n hour filtered in this small tank be hell clean water

Cheerrs Tom

PS the other fish that i got that is new seesm to be totally clean and fine not one ich spot on him and his in the same tank getting salt bathed just to get hsi health 100 percent

That's good Tom. Once the underlying problem is resolved, his tail may grown back. Sometimes they don't but this won't affect his quality of life as long as his water is perfect.

How many times have you added more salt? Are you keeping it at 0.3% - no more?

IM DOING AS YOU SUGGESTED. EVERY 12 HOURS IM ADDING ABOUT A FLAT TEASPOON OF GROUDNED UP SALT STIRRED IN WARM WATER... DISOLVED BEFORE I POUR IT IN. He does seem to be moving around more which im guessing is a good sign and i ahve emptied my bigger tank outtodya and leetting somew ater sit in it (fresh water from the tap) with around about 3 tablespoons of marine salt in there just to double check that ich will die Then on tuesday/Wednesday hopefully ill see full improivements on him and if not he will stay and the other healthy fish will go into the bigger tank while he reminas in the hospital tank... his ich doesnt seem to affect the black gold fish at all he seems 100 percent fine.

Weird eh?

Cant wait till i move out of my parents house ina few years and buy a 150 litre tank

Tom, check the instructions i've quoted from my original post and please tell me how many times you've added the salt.... You should only do it 3 times taking you to 0.3%

How many times have you added the salt?

Hopefully it's not much more then the 3 times otherwise let me know just how many and we can calculate how much water to change to bring you to 0.3%

PS - it's fun having bigger tanks because IHMO they're much easier to look after

A question from me too...you said you are adding one TEASPOON every twelve hours? Is that one teaspoon per gallon or one teaspoon total?

Good question Jen Otherwise he may need to add more....

1 teaspoon every 12 hours after i take 50 percent of the water out of this 16 litre tank with aquao one filter and air stone going....and that teaspoon is in total not per gallon

Ahhhh....well as you have a 4 gallon tank, the way it should have been done is:

- 4 teaspoons of salt (for your 4 gallon) = 0.1%
- then 12 hours later, another 4 teaspoons of salt = 0.1% + 0.1% = 0.2%
- then 12 hours later, the last 4 teaspoons of salt = 3 x 0.1% = 0.3%

A salinity level of 0.3% is what kills ich.

Is there any way you can try to do a calculation of how many teaspoons of salt you've added? I think you may need to add more of the ich will continue to hang around.

Does this all make sense?

yer does so 16 litres is around 4 gallons and i need to add 4 teaspoons hmmm hektik! cheers!