hi
I am new on this forum and i already need help!!!!
I got a goldfish tank about two weeks ago and i made the mistake of bying fish before the tank could cycle i have had two major water clouding problems and i am at a loss it is a 15L tank and i have a stingray 10 filter if any one could give me some info it would be great i just realy dont want my fish to die because they realy are amazing pets
thanks!

Hi and welcome to the site.

Have you tested for ammonia, nitrites, ntirates and Ph as well as hardness? This will help us to help you in what could be going on.

Some cloudiness can be a bacterial bloom, but to be sure you should test those above and be sure.

Cloudy is to be expected in a new tank.
Could you tell us how many goldies are in the tank and how big they are?
and how much of what you're feeding them.
Ditto. water test readings would be very helpful.

well i used to have five i now only have four
my one goldie was very bloated i actualy though she was pregnant but when i went to check up she had died
the live ones are on hagen nutrafin and i feed them twice a day
unfortunately i dont have any kind of testers but i have added biostart to help the filter out a bit
i am a complete newbie to goldfish and i realy love my little fish i was also wondering if the size of the tank (15L) could be a problem!
thanks you very much for your replys!

Oh my gosh. that's 4 goldies in only 4 US gallons (15L) of water. No wonder you're having trouble! you need about 4 liters per goldie.

So have you read up on cycling yet?
If not here is some good reading
http://www.marineland.com/articles/1firstthirty.asp

your goldies release ammonia. it's toxic. Until the bacteria in the filter that convert ammonia to nitrIte get up to speed, ammonia builds up and can kill them if you're not monitoring it and doing partial water changes and/or using an ammonia binder such as amquel to reduce ammonia levels. It takes a 2 or 3 weeks for the ammonia eaters to get up to speed.

The other set of bacteria in the filter convert nitrIte (still toxic) to nitrAte (less toxic) it takes them another 2 or 3 weeks to get up to speed. so again, monitoring your nitrIte levels and doing partial water changes to keep them low are essential. Salt can also be used to help make nitrIte less toxic. NitrIte enters thru the gills and binds up the red blood cells keeping them from being able to carry oxygen. Salt helps protect against nitrIte poisoning because it competes with nitrIte for uptake thru the gills. After you get it salted,

Can you get them into more water?

I'd change out about half of the water per day, making sure to match the temperature and dechlorinate.

I'd add 1 teaspoon of salt for every 4 liters of water. predissolve in tank water and make sure it disperses well when you add it. rock salt works fine. You can use table salt as long as it doesn't contain yellow prussiate of soda. Rock salt is cheap and works well. when you do partial water changes just add 1 tsp of salt per gallon for the next 3 weeks, then you can skip adding any more salt. Your partial water changes will then remove it over time.

I'd also cut back on feeding them. more food results in more ammonia.

Can you take some of your tank and tap water to a pet store and get them to test it for you? Have them tell you specific numbers for
ammonia,
nitrIte
nitrAte
pH
KH
GH

Thanks i will definitely try and get them into a bigger tank! the guy at the pet store said i could keep ten in that size tank he obviously doesnt know what he is talking about!! and he gave me water out of the tank that the fish where in! well i have been doing partial water changes of about 5L im just worried that that is too much!and im using nutrivec biostart is that a good thing? my other problem is i live in south africa and our pet stores here dont do nothing for nothing! for the tests you sugested it would cost me the equivelent of $100 because anything to do with pets here is rediculously expensive! i just realy love my fish and i dont want another one of my babies to die! i was wondering if you could maybe tell me why my goldie died? She was very bloated(it looked like the pictures of pregnant gold fish i had seen on the net) and she would stay at the bottom and hardly move she was like that for about two days she wasnt eating either and i found her floating at the top of my tank!!!!! well thank you so much for all your help i realy apriciate it!!! i had a look at your site and it is brilliant! i am a webpage designer myself and i do various dhtml and javascript designs and i would also like to do a site on my tank - from beginig to maturity! anyway thamk you for all your advice!
kyle!

You're welcome.
I haven't made time to learn javascript yet. need to. I use VBS cuz I already knew basic from way back when (mid-late 80s).

he's a pet store ninny!

No, that's not too much water changes given you're way overstocked and the tank isn't cycled. Gotta keep the water from getting toxic, or they'll get sick.

A temporary solution would be transferring them, the filter, gravel, etc into a large plastic tub. more water would dilute down the ammonia, etc.

It sounds like dropsy.. which is when their organs fail and fluid builds up inside them. It's usually from a bacterial infection I think.

So how is everyone else looking and acting?

well the others are ok but i think when i get them into a new tank they will be much better
even after every water change (i am changing 5L out of 15L per day) they look much better and i am only feeding them in the morning
i was also wondering if the fact that i smoke in the same room as them will effect them in any way!
well next time i post i will get a picture of my tank amd my fishies and you can tell me what you think
my tank is very boreing at the moment i only have the gravel the filter one plastic plant and my fishies !!! should i rather get a live plant ive heard that is good with keeping the amonia levels down
i think with all the research i have done i should be an expert! lol
but i am far from that anyway thank you again im realy glad that someone out there is interested in my poor little tank!!!

It is good to hear that your other fish are still okay! I will keep my fingers crossed for them

I am very new to goldfish, too, so I don't have much in the way of advice - however, I am very interested in your little tank and I'll keep sending good fishy thoughts your way!

So how long has the tank been set up?

I've never heard of nutrivec biostart, so I don't know whether it will help or not.

well i finaly go a chance to get my water tested and the good news is i have no ammonia no nitrite but i do have rather high nitrate levels so thats much better news and my tank has cleared up alot and i have uploaded a few pictures on my soon to be site the adress is www.mytank.150m.com and you can see my sweet little fishes there
do you know how to get the nitrate levels down? one of my friends said i should just keep changeing my water well thanks alot and keep posting!

That is good news! Yep... partial water changes will bring nitrAte down. If you have decent lighting plants can help.

well i have a new problem my sailfined molly seems to have developed ick but i dont know if its not that its a male and its realdy to mate? and my one comet has like white spots on its tail i realy hope these fish are ok!
would you be able to sugest something that i could trat these condtions with? well thanks for you help!!!

So do they look like grains of salt sprinkled on?

Rid ich+ contains formalin and malachite green. That combined with gravel vacuuming should clear ich. If the molly isn't salt sensitive, you could use .3% salt combined with gravel vacuuming to remove cysts and swarmers. the ich lifecycle only has one stage you can kill. The spot are in the fish and the cysts are resistant to treatment. It's only the free swimming swarmers that can be killed.