Hi - I told Deirdre I'd post about little Pippin. His fins are much better, but now his eyes look a bit popped and one of them seems to have whitish 'skin' growing over the rim. We will try to get pics. I had thought she ought to continue a second course of the bettamax, which seemed to cure the tail rot, but she wasn't sure it was a good idea.

His situation: He's in an eclipse 6 gallon with biowheel filter, about 1/2 inch of gravel, a couple of baby java ferns, some java moss, a small piece of driftwood and a few rocks - also a bristlenose pleco called Luna Lovegood. Pippin and Luna seem to stress each other out just a bit at feeding time; he loves her algae wafers and she's a slow eater, so she usually has to chase him off. They ignore each other most of the time, though. Deirdre changes 20 to 30 percent of the water about once a week. When last tested (not too recently), there were no ammonia or nitrites and nitrates were around 20. PH was 7.5, approximately. She treats the water with stresscoat and ages it before changes.

After noticing their condition yesterday - (Pippin's eyes and what looked like a red streak on Luna - but she's an albino, so it's hard to tell if she has red streaks) - Deirdre got very worried. She wants to get Pip better and would like to know how best to treat him. TIA for your help!

hemorrhagic septicemia: red streaks on fins or body with no sign of skin damage. does that sound like luna's problem? if so you could try jungle - fungus clear. each tablet treats 10 gallons,but i'm sure u could cut them in half since your tank is only 6 gallons. fungus clear is supposed to clear pop eye,the hemorrhagic septicemia,and lot's of other stuff. here's a link to it online: http://bigalsonline.com/catalog/product.xm...id1=2233;pcid2=

hope this helps

also,i have been searching the internet,and i've found another medicine that might work well:

Maracyn–Two
Manufacturer: Mardel
A broad-spectrum antibiotic for internal or external gram negative bacterial infections which can even be absorbed through the skin. Effective treatment of fin and tail rot, popeye, gill disease, dropsy (swollen body, protruding scales), septicemia (bleeding or red streaks on the body), secondary and internal infections. Effective even when fish won't eat.
Active ingredient: Mincycline hydrochlor.

here is a link to it online as well: http://www.petco.com/familylisting.asp?fam...acyn-Two+online

Thanks! i also spoke to our vet, and he didn't think they sounded desparately ill - he does think the tank is nearly maxed out, with four inches or so of fish in it, and that they might indeed be suffering from PH or ammonia problems. Deirdre thinks so, too, since she noticed the cat - or somebody - had managed to step on the surge protector switch and turn off the filter. I've had reasonably good experiences with fungus clear, and have some left, so I'll suggest that to her. Maracyn 2 has been less effective for me - but, in any case, I think I have both of them left from Poly's bout with tail rot. And we're going to watch the current and the water quality.

if i remember correctly septicemia can be caused from water quality,and is very contagious,and can be fatal if not taken care of.
good luck

Thanks, Thelonius - Deirdre tried the maracyn-2; we've just finished one course of it and and she thinks they look better - but Pip, in particular, isn't completely better. She woant to know whether she can give them a second course of treatment, or whether she should perhaps try something else? She's worried about the med degrading the water quality y crashing the filter -so, if she does give them a second course, she wants to know the procedure. Should she do another big water change? Maybe put carbon back in the filter and run it for awhile? Or is it safe to start the second dose right away after a 25% water change? Thanks again for your help.

just bouncing this so people see it - he is worse today, and she's getting desperate. I'm trying to find either fungus clear or fungus eliminator for her.

Hi Mary,

Thanks for bouncing this because I missed it the first time.

I know you have been treating them with antibiotics but in the back of my mind I keep thinking water quality especially ammonia poisoning.

Has your friend tested her water lately? I think you said that the last test were sometime again. Could you please ask her to test the water ASAP.

Okay - we tested before we went on vacation, at which time Deirdre did a really massive cleaning of the tank. She has an ammonia alert thing in the tank; it read zero, and so did the other ammonia test I tried. No nitrites, either, and nitrates - which were high - were above 20. ph about 7.5; temp 79 F. If there is any ammonia in the tank, it's just a trace, and bettas aren't supposed to be quite as sensitive as other fish?

However, she's worried that two things in the tank (other than Luna lovegood) might be stressing him out. First, she's afraid the current is too strong for him, though she does all she can to block it with real and plastic plants. Second, she's noticed he often flares at his reflection in the back of the tank - she has a blue backing on there, and he can see himself. Is it possible that these two things, more than anything else, caused his illness? Should she try to correct them?

As I said, she's also worried about how to medicate, and with what. Is it possible to treat him in a bowl, or should she treat the whole tank? What medications are most effective against finrot in a betta? Would it be possible to use tricide neo on him?

Thanks for your response. Am going to start calling petstores now, to see if I can locate those meds.

Mary

Gee, I'm not sure tricide neo is safe for bettas.

I think you might want to talk to Jenn about finrot. She is battling some nasty ones at the moment. I adviced her to use iodine swab on one and it had good result but it is not applicable in every case. I believe she is using tetracycline at the moment.

With antibiotic treatments, you should do several water changes after the full course is completed to remove the meds before starting a new course or use other meds. You don't want to expose the fish to weak antibiotics for a prolonged period as it can lead to drug resistant bugs. Some antibiotics and meds don't mix so it is not wise to turn the tank into a meds cocktail either.

Oh forgot to mention. With the current, is it being spun around or he can still find a quiet spot to rest? Can she remove the blue backing?

yes, she can remove the backing, and i'm sure she will if you all say it's advisable. As for quiet areas in the tank - that's the problem. Ordinarily the corner just to one side of the filter intake is quiet - it's where she feeds him - but, after a water change, especially if she's also cleaning the dirt off the plastic plants, the current changes. It takes quite a bit of fooling around with the plants to get it to quiet down again. So Pippin's situation is not unlike that of my goldie - he has no trouble actually swimming, and doesn't seem to be getting blown around, but I think he might be having problems resting.

Deirdre's other betta, Rubeus, is in a 1-gallon bowl, and she gives him a complete water change every week. He is the healthiest of all our fish. "Maybe Pip would do better in a bowl?" she asked. Would he?

Sometimes bettas defy our understandings. It is not unusual to find some bettas that actually prefer the confinement of a small bowl. Maybe Pippin is one of those. It is worthwhile giving it a try and if it doesn't work out then return him to the tank.

BTW, if the backing is not essential then removing it will just eliminate another possible trouble spot. Also with the currents, you can use a piece of clear plastic to form a partition and semi divide the tank into halves or thirds. Then at least there is a section that is always quieter.

Just wanted to give you an update, and thank you again for your help. The fungus eliminator *finally* came late last week, so we started him on it on thursday - he gets the second dose today. We are doing water changes every 4 days, and Deirdre has removed the backing. No change in either fish so far, but I guess that 's not bad. Poor Pip's tail is nearly gone - not many signs of rot in his other fins, though. He's still swimming, and still eating well. I hope we see some positive response to the med in a few days. Will let you know.