i totally forgot that i found this a while back!

http://digitalcheese.ca/gallery/album11

this is for the "hardcore" tinkerer only!

no takers huh?

i dont blame you! it seems more of a novelty rather than a necessity. for freshwater aquariums, that is. they do have there uses in reef tanks where nitrates have to be kept to a minimum.

Sorry, been busy with various "real world projects", which has been cramping my on-line time.

Very interesting project, but I don't think I need it, so I'll pass.

However, I am awaitng results from your other projects you have listed. *grin*

That looks fantastic. I want one.

What is it?

Forgive my ignorance, but I've not seen one of these devices before. The name suggests to me that they remove nitrates, but how?

the concept goes like this:

the beneficial bacteria that we as aquarists rely on are nitrosomas and nitrobacter. somas and bacter are aerobic bacteria (needing oxygen to live). they convert ammonia to nitrates. witch is fine and dandy!

there is also types of bacteria that are anaerobic (needs low to no oxygen levels) witch convert nitrates into nitrogen. sulfur (toxic to fish) is a byproduct of this chemical process and can be purged with the addition of a bubbler.

with that in mind............the unit you see in the link pushes water very slowly through the small tube wrapped around the inside of the main body. as the water flows through the small tube, it loses oxygen. around three quarters of the way through is where the anaerobic bacteria begins. once it passes through the small tube into the main body, the waters nitrate content is converted to nitrogen witch dissapates into the air. the slfuric byproduct is dissapated by running the water into a trough that has an aerator going. then the water is pumped or drips back into the tank.

hope this helps a bit!

Ok, now I really really want one.

This officailly goes on my list of things to do when I have free time. (Which may not be for a good long while...)

one question, after buliding ure water polisher i can say id trust ure inventions... as im curious how well this will work.... I have been convinced to use sand as my gravel and now need an establishment of some type of biological system... this sounds great but how well will it work.... i need something urgent... as there is no biological filtration happening in my tank at the very moment im chasing poop all over the place in the tank and relying on the water polisher/powerhead filter

thnaks in advanced

p.s dont worry ive got enough current to break the surface to supply oxygen in the tank for the fishys....

do not use sand. sand can cause a variety of problems in goldies (gill and intestinal).

why not purchase yourself a good hob filter (aqua-clear is great)? if money is the problem, you could construct yourself a good canister filter. check out my post on the diy cannister. youll only need about 20 dollars for hoses, gaskets and connectors. youll be able to employ your powerhead that you already have!

good luck and post back if you run into any snags!

gill and intestinal ? oohs and arrghs.... thanks for informing me about problems but my fish seem to be ok ill see how they go......

ohh by the way i signed up to this forum becos i was interested in ure designs "TOOTHLESS" if u were here in aussie id buy u a BEER!

i dont have goldfish, but i have warm fresh water AFRICAN CICHLIDS. you can do a little search on them some of the fish i have are


-electric blue
-electric yellow
-clown loach
-red empress
-saulosi

hmm, did I come across this thread before or did I found this on the website.. whatever it is, it was quite a loooong while back..

anyway, I do see a risk.. if it ever leaks, and the final products flows back into the main tank, wont it be fatal to the fishes..

I was very tempted by the idea.. but the risk puts me to think manual water change is still more reliable..

fi5hkiller,

yeah, this was just a little something that i came across while googling around. manual water changes definitely are much easier (for freshwater). anyway, about the only thing that could hurt your fish would be if the bubbler quit and the sulfuric byproduct didnt dissapate enough before working its way back to the tank. but, there are failsafes for even that instance (ie. two bubblers). either way, its a little too much tinkering for just nitrates. although, if you were to leave town for more than a couple weeks and didnt have anybody to do correct water changes, this unit would have its advantages to have running in the background.

psyko,

thanks for the compliments on my diy projects! believe me, i wish i was there. ive always wanted to visit "the gold coast". im a surfer and would loooove to surf "kirra".

p.s. ive got a coldie in front of me right now! cheers, mate! :glup

This is fascinating.

Do you think a "continuous drip" system would solve the problem of both water changes AND nitrates anyways. It seems to an easier system too!

What do you think?

cool inventions, but i would also stick to manual changing of water.

Actually, the continuous drip could be set to make 100% water changes every week if you want, or more. But this isn't the right set up for your everyday application. It's for a basement or an outside pond.

I do want to build one. I've been adding plants potted in topsoil for denitrification and have about half the tank covered with plants. That's helping with nitrAtes, but still not keeping them down enough to avoid large weekly partial water changes.

I picked up some bioballs on the cheap at our last aquarium club meeting. Hopefully next month, I'll get the rest of the stuff and put one together.

Hmm, it's all greek to me , unfortunately the left side of my brain is overactive to the detriment of the right side. I envy you guys/gals who can build things and make them work.

Cheers! Annette

PS. Paul, is that quote in your signature from Ghandi (revolutionary, spiritual leader, etc)? What do the initials M.K stand for?

sorry guys!

i havent been in here in a while. anyway, here goes:

ed,

well, im not very well versed in pondkeeping so, i dont know much about how quickly or how high nitrates can climb in a pond (such as yours or otherwise). however, since its not a natural pond, i would say that its nothing other than a large tank. with that in mind, a denitator might actually help you with your weekly water changes. a unit for a pond like yours might need to actually be a bit larger than what the one in the photos show. maybe double. anyway, the thing about this denitator unit is that it wouldnt clean out the much theorized growth inhibiting hormone that fish give out. you can read some more about that in the tanks forum, its pinned at the top. but, i believe that living by that theory is more for smaller ponds and tanks that are maxed out to capacity. ill let you decide that for yourself.

im sure that with your crafty hand, youll have noooo prroblems at all constructing one! good luck and post back if you need any info!

annette,

im not exactly sure what the initials stand for. wasnt his name mahatma ghandi? maybe the k is his middle name. ill have to look that up. i just really like that saying and try to live as close to that truth as i can.

paul

So true Paul, so true . No need to look up the initial "k", I just couldn't think of his first name - mental block after trying to get my head around all those technical thingies.

Water changes take out many more things than just nitrates but that is one parameter that most of us don't have a problem getting a reading for. We tend
too think that after we take care of the basics (ammonia,nitrites, nitrates) we are good too go but that is far from the truth.
So lets say we can use such an item too reduce nitrates. Of course that is good in the long run but NOTHING can replace a good old water change.
Paul mentioned pheremones as being one of those items that are not affected. There are probably hundreds of other water parameters that we just can't get a reading on unless we want too spend THOUSANDS of dollars on test equipment. Some parameters probably even defy any testing equipment.
So keep up those water changes because when it all comes down too it we are keeping our fish in a never ending sewer. And thats a fact.

Yes, I'm not sure if everyone understood that I was thinking the de-nitrator was not needed for most applications if you have frequent water changes.

The continuous drip system is continually changing water. It's not the same system as the de-nitrator.

Yeah - continuous drip system, that sounds good.

i totally agree! nothing can beat nice big water changes. no matter what medias and whatnot you add to the filtration, waterchanges are still the best thing going.

paul

I have 4 goldies in the 55 gallon tank: 1 9" moor, a 6" ryunkin, a 6" moor, and a 3" oranda producing about 3ppm ammonia per day.
That runs up about 9ppm nitrAte per day.
Over the week between water changes that would be 63 ppm nitrAte added to the tank.
First week up to 63ppm
50% water change only gets you down to 31ppm.
second week up to 94ppm
50% water change only gets you down to 47ppm.
third week up to 110ppm.
See the problem.

Even with loading the tank with plants, I'm routinely doing 75% water changes to keep nitrAte down under 40ppm during the week. I'd prefer to keep nitrAte constantly lower and reduce the size of water changes to about 30% weekly.

I don't know what size I'd need for the 55. gonna have to do some more reading.

The hydrogen sulfide issues are indeed scarey with anaerobic denitrification. You think having plent of airation handles that aspect of it?

I'm thinking a plant filter might work well. I have a separate tub I'm using to grow out duckweed, azolla, frogbit and other plants. If I could figure out a way to pump water from the main tank into it and run the lights on it at nite, it would serve triple duty. grow more plants for goldie food, keep CO2 down and O2 up at nite, and suck up nitrAte.