[amynmitchell]

[*]Test Results for the Following:
[*]Ammonia Level? 0ppm
[*]Nitrite Level? 0ppm
[*]Nitrate level? 15 pmm
[*]Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)? 8
[*]Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)? 7.2
[*]Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? API drops
[*]Water temperature? 79
[*]Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 55 gallons (tank change last month)
[*]What is the name and size of the filter(s)? Fluval 305 Magnum HOT 55


[*]How often do you change the water and how much? 75% per week
[*]How many fish in the tank and their size? 3 (four inches each)
[*]What kind of water additives or conditioners? Prime
[*]What do you feed your fish and how often? once a day, gel food, frozen, fruits and veggies
[*]Any new fish added to the tank? Toto last week
[*]Any medications added to the tank? No
[*]Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? No
[*]Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? No

I'm think this probably isn't a big worry, but just in case I thought I would check. Toto is terribly clumsy and has no sense of her size, which explains why she got stuck in the one ornament in the QT tank and lost a scale. I HP swabbed that and it healed fine.

I just noticed a few days ago a pink scratch on her cheek wen. It has a tiny indention and is pink. I'm guessing she bumped into something again. I haven't HP swabbed it because I hate to stress her out if it isn't necessary. Should I be worried? Should I swab it or do anything else? Thanks!

A few semi-helpful pictures...she is too fast!

http://i310.photobuc.../Totoscrape.jpg

http://i310.photobuc...Totoscrape2.jpg

[shellbell4ever]

Sorry I couldn't make out anything in the pic http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/public/style_emoticons/default/sad.gif My first thougt would be perfect water conditions maybe increase the w/c frequency,but I'm not an expert (LOL)But I sure hope she feels better real soon!!

This post has been edited by shellbell4ever: 28 October 2009 - 02:19 AM

[Anielynn70]

Poor baby. Maybe adding in some salt might be a good idea.

[amynmitchell]

I managed to get much better pictures. She finally sat still. These were taken right after I did her HP swab. It looked a bit bigger to me, so I went ahead and swabbed it. I would love any other ideas as well. I'm not sure how worried I should be.

http://i310.photobuc...Totoscratch.jpg

http://i310.photobuc...otoscratch2.jpg

http://i310.photobuc...otoscratch3.jpg

[Trinket]

Amy, am just wondering about Toto being Qt'd. Did that get done or did she get added at once (we have all done it) ? It could be a superficial scratch if she is new to the tank and its decor -or it could be a skin infection as she is suddenly in contact with all the new bacteria in her new home.

HP was a good interim step certainly. Now it would be watch and wait to see if a) the area heals completely or b) new symptoms appear.

[amynmitchell]

She was QT'd the full month, salt and Prazi for three weeks, plain water the last week. She got it literally a day or two after being added to the new tank. She is really clumsy, so that is my guess, but I hope it isn't anything more than that. If it doesn't heal in the next week or so should I starts MMs?

[amynmitchell]

Well, I just got home from three days in Palm Springs and it looks a little worse to me. I did the HP swab on Wednesday night. Then I started her on Jumpstart to well, jumpstart the healing (she had one dose Thursday morning and one tonight...they missed a feeding Friday because I was out of town). It is white all in the center which is good, but a has a red ring all around the white inside. It has spread a little. I would say that the size is about the size of the eraser of a mechanical pencil, not a regular one if that makes any sense. I took a couple of more pictures of how it looks tonight. Maybe not noticeably different to anyone but me.

Imo, in your opinion how long should I give it to heal up on its own? And at the point when it isn't seeming to heal what course of treatment would you suggest? I have MMs on hand if need be.

http://i310.photobuc...ll/totoface.jpg

http://i310.photobuc...hell/totosc.jpg


Now, I'll try and be patient and wait for Imohttp://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/public/style_emoticons/default/exactly.gif

[MrsMohr]

aww poor baby, i hope she gets better:( She is super cute!

[amynmitchell]

Me, too. I have been fortunate enough to be problem free for a year (knock on wood), so now it sucks to start having an issue. I just hope this is the only issue and it is a minor fix.

Not to change the subject, but did you love Animal Kingdom? My husband and I have been to Disneyworld twice and love it there. If you ever get a chance try the buffet Boma at Animal Kingdom hotel...wonderful!

[Trinket]

Amy if you have fresh MMs I would start her on those not the Jumpstart. I know you are meticulous about water and filtration so if this is getting worse in your good conditions then some med food is probably a good idea.

Sadly every single time we get a new fish there are hidden problems that can surface later. Luckily most of them are resolved easily. The MMs may well do it :)

[amynmitchell]

Okay, MMs it is. The red outer ring is what has me worried. I think it is possibly a scratch that has got some bacterial stuff going on in there since she was new to the tank. Do you suggest a 14 day round of it?

I am reluctant to reset up the QT tank and put her back in it, so my general plan is to fed her seperate in a floating tupperware containter. Will that be okay? I'll try it tonight and she if she eats it.

But my plan is 14 days MMs (if that is the right dose...I can't remember if 30 is better) and then the Jumpstart for 14 days.

Now that I am writing this I just realized a problem. My QT tank was not staying cycled for some reason. And I leave for Chicago Thursday and come back Sunday. I have a husband who won't put his hands in the tank (totally freaks him out) or do water changes (scared he is going to do something to kill them). So that means either she skips a dose Friday and Saturday or I put her in the QT tank and hope it doesn't get high with ammonia or I feed them all MMs for either the whole time or for just Friday and Saturday. So, what is the lessor of the many evils, Imo?

Ugh! Why do I have to travel so much!

[Trinket]

The lesser of the evils is 2 days fast midway with MMs.

14 days is the course. 14 days exactly she must have. No more. No less.

[MrsMohr]

This is pretty much what bartleby's cheek looks like...and it's worse today:(

[amynmitchell]

Thanks, Imo. I tried to show him what it would be like to catch her for her mealtime...he looked pretty freaked. I will make sure she get the 14 day course and I hope it starts looking better. I've read some about hole in the wen disease which has had me a nervous wreck. Should I fast everybody when I'm out of town or have Geoff feed them something else?

For next time we have to figure out what the deal is with the QT tank. We have terrible electricity here and it just randomly shuts off. So, I think every time I went out of town it was shutting off (I hate the test things on outlets, ours just pop out and turn everything off if you have too much running there) and good bbs would die out. Geoff said he noticed a few times that it was turned off. Ugh!

It is weird to thing that Bartleby and Toto have the same thing going on. It would make sense if she had any problems during QT, but despite losing one scale due to getting stuck under an ornament (she really is clumsy) everything went swimmingly.

[amynmitchell]

I am thinking I might go ahead and set up the QT. She is eating the MMs fine in the container, but I am really worried about how large this ulcer like thing looks. Imo, do you suggest doing anything else if it isn't looking better...salt, melafix, a pp bath...just want to have a plan of attack for if things look bad while I'm gone or when I get home. It is starting to lose the red and go mostly white, but it looks bigger to me.

Thanks. I'm worried about her.

[Trinket]

I would be so wary of a QT if you have sudden power cutouts.

Amy can you take a similar angle pic to the last (2nd) pic and we can compare pics to see if it is actually getting bigger? Usually white indicates healing but size increase would not..

It could easily be an aeromonas surface infection after getting scraped on an ornament. Is this also the place she scraped herself? Any break in slime coat can let these nasty bacs in. It doesnt look like hole in the head from what I can see. That starts with pinprcik holes and the fish has a definite "tattered" appearance.

You could salt the whole tank yes. It would help. To 0.2%. It would certainly buy you time so we can see whats developing with this ..

If you have PP granules and feel confident, you could also make a little lotion with them- add a drop of melafix and gently apply that topically. But only once.
I try and avoid topicals where the fish is stressed, skittish or hiding as handling and topical applications really can scare fish and reduce their immunity just when they need it at full power. Its your call on that.

These are some options for a next step. Please don't worry, she is not looking too bad with this right now.

[amynmitchell]

I'm at work, but as soon as I get home I will try and take another picture. I haven't had a problem with a QT cutting out except in that outlet (of course that is the best place to put one), so I could certainly set one up in the less ideal place of our kitchen counter or something. Then I could comfortably salt up to .03 percent. My first guess was that she cut herself in some way. She lost a scale by getting stuck in QT and already had another spot of one missing. It healed super fast though. There wasn't ever a hole, just a tiny round red spot that I didn't worry about at first because she is so clumsy. Three days later I decided to do the HP swab as it wasn't getting any better. Oddly enough it looked worse since then.

I wish I had the PP granuals, but they are illegal in CA so I just have the liquid. I think a PP bath might be jumping the gun a bit now, but I like to know what is coming.

I think my plan right now is to set up the QT somewhere where it won't cut out. Place a baggie of gravel in there and hope the cycle takes. Slowly salt up to .03 percent and keep up the MMs. If that doesn't knock it out then I know something bigger is going on.

Does this sound like a safe plan? I hate that I have to do out of town.

I'll post another picture ASAP.

[amynmitchell]

She is one wiggly kid. It is hard to get non blurry photos. If nothing else you can see the size...it is all the way under her eyeball now. It does look a lot more white, but the red ring is back and I'm seeing some very stringy white poop from her.

http://i310.photobuc...totoface001.jpg

http://i310.photobuc...totoface002.jpg

http://i310.photobuc...totoface003.jpg

http://i310.photobuc...totoface004.jpg

[Trinket]

Amy -am at work too so cant stop in long. Back later...

Just quickly to say that the QT plan sounds good - unforunately with salt zeolite is not an option so the cycle bbs will need to be checked for a few days to show they are working okay (they should do). Make sure the QT water is EXACTLY the same temp as bbs are extra sensitive to cold (especially) and changes of pH and temp. Lots of bubbles, same light as she is use to.

Certainly looks like a typical aeromonas body sore.
We can talk water meds/dips if shes no better after your trip. Salt plus MMs may do it meanwhile as shes active and has appetite.

[amynmitchell]

Thanks, Imo. I'll get her set up and then we will see what happens from there.